Soundbite: Friends of TPV with Daniel Hill

“Don’t die with the music still inside of you.”

That’s a quote attributed to Dr Wayne Dwyer and/or his wife, Serena Dwyer. However, as reminded tu us here by Daniel Hill, its origins actually stem from ancient wisdom rooted in Chinese philosophy.

Indeed, we go on a bit of a tour, considering philosophy, psychology and spirituality, as we contemplate our life’s meaning and purpose.

We also debate the differences between being an entrepreneur and a businessperson influenced by the roles of nature and nurture.

Then, there’s the idea of better understanding people, starting with a better understanding of ourselves. We discuss personality profiles with the Wealth Dynamics one in particular, along with the bizarrely accurate Human Design spiritual practice and test and even the Five Love Languages, would you believe?

Daniel Hill is someone that I have known for some time, although mostly from a distance. However, during the course of this year we have connected more, done several business deals together and realised that we share a lot of common values. This is why I invited him to join me in this mini-series with some of the friends of TPV, bridging the old to the new direction of the podcast.

I think you’ll find much of the conversation interesting, stimulating and at times possibly even deep and meaningful. When you come to think of it, that’s quite a profound idea for two blokes chatting on a podcast…

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Transcription of the show

“Don’t die with the music still inside of you.”

That’s a quote attributed to Dr Wayne Dwyer and/or his wife, Serena Dwyer. However, as reminded tu us here by Daniel Hill, its origins actually stem from ancient wisdom rooted in Chinese philosophy.

Indeed, we go on a bit of a tour, considering philosophy, psychology and spirituality, as we contemplate our life’s meaning and purpose.

We also debate the differences between being an entrepreneur and a businessperson influenced by the roles of nature and nurture.

Then, there’s the idea of better understanding people, starting with a better understanding of ourselves. We discuss personality profiles with the Wealth Dynamics one in particular, along with the bizarrely accurate Human Design spiritual practice and test and even the Five Love Languages, would you believe?

Daniel Hill is someone that I have known for some time, although mostly from a distance. However, during the course of this year we have connected more, done several business deals together and realised that we share a lot of common values. This is why I invited him to join me in this mini-series with some of the friends of TPV, bridging the old to the new direction of the podcast.

I think you’ll find much of the conversation interesting, stimulating and at times possibly even deep and meaningful. When you come to think of it, that’s quite a profound idea for two blokes chatting on a podcast…

Property Chatter

Welcome to the property voice podcast helping you to navigate safely through the world of property investing, get the lowdown and updates, insights and outcomes on all matters property with a splash of entertainment along the way, the property voice, a voice to trust among the crowd. Now, let’s get started with your host, Richard Brown.

Hello, and welcome to another episode of the property voice podcast. My name is Richard Brown. And as always, it’s a pleasure to have you join me again on the show today. Now it’s just doing this little interlude mini-series was just a couple of like my property and business friends really, and some have been friends for a long time. And some of being friends and contacts have come into my life more recently, but I’ve had a profound effect. And today’s guest is Mr. Daniel Hill, who is in that latter category. I’ve been watching you down. But from a distance, by the way, for a long, long time. But obviously we’ve kind of had quite a lot of crossovers in recent times. And it’s a pleasure to have you joined me on my podcast, and maybe I’ll be put out on your podcast, who knows? See what how that goes. But welcome to the property voice podcast. Thanks, Max. Pleasure. No, great. So we got no idea how this is gonna go. We did maybe have a few thoughts. But I think it’s just to guys having a chat, really. And I think, you know, there’s, as I mentioned, you know, we’ve kind of got to know each other quite well, you know, recent times, especially. But and I think we can talk about some of that and why it happened. I don’t know which bits we can talk about which we can’t because some of it might be under NDA. But I think would be really useful, particularly for my audiences, would you mind giving us a helicopter view of yourself and your own background so they can picture? You know who you are, where you come from what you do type of thing, if you wouldn’t mind? Yeah, absolutely. So my name is Daniel Hill. And I’ve been in business all my life started life as an entrepreneur about three years old. And several decades later, for whatever reason, I’m still doing that. And started in business as at my first full-time business at 15. And start an events company, then started a self-employed construction business. And then pretty quickly realized, I didn’t want to be the person shoveling in the sand every day along with the person build houses, so should probably figure out what business is all about. So it’s university degree in Strategic entrepreneurship, which is all about looking at markets and industries and curves. And waves are trying to find those little high-value sweet spots where you can get in. And during my placement year, which was year three, I had an employee job for the first time in my life. And after about 12 weeks, I was actually facing the sack of disciplines, I got reprimanded, and then they’re actually gonna fire me. And the area, the area manager came in and said, I don’t know what you’ve done, we’ve doubled sales to 2.4 million pounds, we want to promote you and give you an award. And I thought this has taught me two things. One is, I never want to work for anyone ever again. And also if you can look outside the box and do things that are different to the things he got sacked for. And the results can be quite good. So know when to bend the rules just don’t know when not to break them. And then do a little trading group started locally scaled it nationally, and then sold back in 2011 2012 went into property because the market plateaued. And that was always my plan. And then started a trading group called PPN. UK. And one of the UK needed proxy groups. Now the focus on investment, we used to do management, we didn’t train and we do development. And I’ve been doing that for the last 10 years. So that’s what I focus on now. Very good. I mean, it’s quite a lot we could pick up there by the way. Wherever you want. You Was that your first and only job by the way. Obviously now you did. Yeah. Was that your first nanny job the one you did in your placement year. At the university, I sort of did like that set, self-employed building and stuff like that, but it’s my job my full time. 40-hour week job. Yeah, so you’re basically a businessman, entrepreneur, whatever language you want to use through really I was born with that, but more of an entrepreneur, I used to be more of an entrepreneur and a businessman. I think I’ve learned the skills of business and actually when you can be an entrepreneur or a business that actually adds a lot of value. I think was born an entrepreneur probably learn how to be a businessman. Yeah, it’s interesting distinction, not draw on that. But I just can’t help it pit have picked up what you said about when you  said you were in business from three years old?

Is that right? Well, it’s sort of like when people talk about entrepreneurs born, or you know, is it a job that you learn? My earliest memories was being about three years old family Christmas day, while everyone else was playing with their toys, I’ve managed to get one of the cardboard boxes, and I’ve cut a little hole in it, I was taking money off the adults and giving them sweets. But that was not my first thing of constantly focusing on value exchange revenue, like, you know, and then it just seemed like what I was interested in, and now it’s now it’s what I do for a living say, Oh, now that’s what I enjoyed it. So yeah, that’s, that’s intriguing. And so there’s this discussion sometimes between nature and nurture. You know, are you born a bit, you know, entrepreneur? Can you be grown into one? And you talked about perhaps a distinction between entrepreneurship and being a business person? You know, what’s your view generally on that? Well, nature, nurture is really interesting, because I actually heard that terminology a few years ago, and it’s a great question. What do you think about entrepreneurs specifically, do you think your learn doing is a learned behavior? I think is a born trait. I mean, yeah, yeah, I think the thing, there’s a natural tendency to be an entrepreneur, I think, you know, normally, and there’s some clues that we can pick up. Some people just know, like, when you’re three years old, you probably just don’t know if you’re conscious of it. But you know, you it was sort of part of you, and various parts of your life pointed to it. But I think I actually went into business a little bit later. So I spent a bit of time in corporate land, as I call it, nearly getting fired. You know, quite a lot, actually, normally for saying too much speak, you know, speak it out, that’s a load of rubbish, what you want to do that for, I was kind of known for that kind of, you know, insightful, helpful feedback to senior leadership. But I think, you know, there were always clues. And Steve Jobs says you can only join the dots looking back, but I think I was likened it to, you know, going with the grain, or going against the grain. And it just feels right now, if you dropped silt down, you know, the wrong direction on wood, it will either stick or flow nicely, right. And I think it’s an inner feeling. And that’s what I sense. So as an entrepreneur, you, just feel you sense, you’re either in the right place or in the wrong place. And I’ve definitely had, you know, decent, you know, despite telling my bosses, they didn’t know what they’re doing. But I’m at a decent, successful corporate career, to a degree to an extent. But I was kind of it just didn’t feel right. I just didn’t feel I was in the right environment. And I do actually, remember, I set two goals when I was in my late teens, I’ll come back to you in a sec, by the way, do get on a roll. But I set two goals in my late teens. One was to run my own business. And the second was to write a book. And now, I didn’t do either. Until, you know, much later, really, I did start my own business when I was, I think I was 30. So I was 30. When I start my first business, and I wrote my first book. Gosh, well, it was 2015. It was published. That doesn’t actually help you, because you don’t know how necessarily hold on. But I was like it was it was 3035 years in the making the book. Anyway, back to you. So you asked me but what about you? What’s your thoughts? On other? No, I think it’s the nature and nurture. I think there’s lots of bits to it. I think. If you’re wanting to well, sort of more scientific, academic, there’s sort of some people are left brain thinkers, some people are right brain, some people are more creative and intuitive. Some people are more analytical, some people or do some more visual, I think that element is probably born. I think it’s just the way your brain works. You know, some people have long legs, some people have short legs, some people have creative brains, some people have analytical brains, I think that part’s quite boring. So then obviously, that puts you into one of four categories, I would probably fall into the I think I would probably fall into the dynamic, creative, sort of space. And whereas I think perhaps, from my experience doing business with you, you probably have the creative dynamic side, but also have the analytical data driven side, which is actually probably one of the best positions to be in, especially for business ownership, and then also believe you’ve got to develop anything, so you’re born, and you can choose how far you want to progress and I’ve been an entrepreneur my whole life. So obviously it’s been quite a narrow experience, but I’ve got really deep so I do think I am really good at that one thing. So I’ve got really deep with that. Those I believe in other things about things like

spirituality, I believe things about the soul, even that the woowoo stuff like astrology and human design, when you believe in that sort of stuff, it’s, you know, you’re here for a purpose and actually also believe you’re here to do something. And I don’t know the answer to the question, but I believe we have more control over everything than we think. But we also have a lot less control over what we say. So the sort of a bit of an academic answer and a bit of a woowoo answer for her? Well, I think that I mean, it’s fascinating. To be fair, I think, humor design, by the way, it’s a really fascinating topic, to my model, and for those of you listeners who’ve never heard, it’s given me it basically, given the date, and the place you were born and the time, and they’ll give you a reading, and it tells you exactly who you are. And every person I’ve recommended it to, has done that, and they don’t even know your name, or your email address or your IP, whatever you call it. It’s like, yeah, it’s mind-boggling. It is, I’ve actually had a reading, it is mind-boggling. And I do like the fact of design. Pardon? What Human Design profile? Oh, my gosh, I forgot. I’ll have to look it up now. I don’t know don’t ask me difficult questions. That’s one thing in my in for me is, I do forget things. So I have to document things as I go. I’ll look it up as I go along. But I tell you, what, we are whole whole beings. Alright. And I think no matter if people think well, because we started talking about this bit when we talk about differences in entrepreneurship and being like a business, man or person. And I think, you know, possibly business person is like skills or competencies driven. Whereas been more entrepreneurial, excuse me, I need to drink some water to being more entrepreneurial is more of a natural tendency. And I think you can put the two together. So if your two skills, ie competency, modularly, you know, you can lose people, and potentially, but if you’re too entrepreneurial idea here, idea, their head in the clouds. Next Big Thing, you might not, you know, have the foundations and the grounding to have a successful business potentially. So there’s a bit of a being in any entrepreneur or business. Well, I think my natural tendency is entrepreneurial, but I’ve got learned behaviors. And so when you talk about your observation, and B, for example, you said I’ll perhaps got a bit of analytical in you. And that’s, that’s kind of a learned behavior. So I was, you know, accountancy trained. When I left uni, I didn’t have a brain for numbers. But you know, when I was accountancy training, so it was a discipline that I learned, you know, can read a balance sheet and stuff like that. But I tried to be an accountant for a while. I hated it. absolutely hated it. But that’s really one of the most dynamics with wealth dynamics. Yeah. So I’m create a primary profile. Yes, you’re the creative mechanic in that top left corner, which in my opinion, is it probably conflicts of interest because on the side, but that is definitely the best. If you’re creating mechanic on well on human design, I wouldn’t be surprised if you’re a manifesting generator. So manifesting. I think that rings a bell now. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, manifesting means you can manifest, you know, you create dynamic, you can see you in your garden, you’ve got that foresight and vision, but generators, it’s Duracell bunny, you can actually go out and make things happen. You’re not. You know, you’re not you don’t just talk a good game, but lots of people. Yeah, I’m trying to look it up. It’s not very good for a podcast made looking something up. But most of what my profile is. Come on, tell me. Oh, yeah, I am. That’s what I am manifesting. Very interesting. We literally the same wealth dynamics profile. And the same manifesting generalized, I don’t know, the same human desire. I don’t know if I spoke to anybody else who is the same on both of those. So they go. I did have a sneaky feeling. To be fair, I think you use obviously, study that in maybe observing other people and try and read other people. I imagine that their toys use it or study. Well, yeah. Do you mean you were like commenting on me? And you are wondering if you’re this or you’re that do you actually utilize it in that way? So think about who you’re engaging with and maybe what would get the best sort of response

out of them. The absolute problems now we teach advanced communication, which is basically  Why do some people think other people are weird? Why do some people think other people acquire why don’t why? Other people think other people are allowed. And it’s about understanding the different dyeing the different profiles and how to communicate and whether you’re doing deals, or you’re just having a chance to have a decent conversation your business partner is, is understanding how to communicate in their language, because most people don’t communicate, which annoys other people. Yeah, exactly. And a few taken us a little bit of tangent. But if you look at sort of relationships, I mean, romantic relationships and things like, you know, The Five Love Languages, or what am I? Oh, no. I’m, what am I? So there’s five of them. So I’m sure well, come on, you tell me you’re supposed to not read might remember my own. So for those who’ve never heard of the languages allow, it’s basically in the same way that introverted people are really quiet and reserved an extra day people are really loud, if you’re allowed to acquire this, and they get overwhelmed as you call it allow person they get bored. It’s understanding what language the other person uses to communicate when you use that in relationship school, the love languages, and there’s five of them. And it’s basically a really good understanding how to make your partner happy, but also how to not judge your partner by your own standards. Because if what’s important to you, is not important to them. And they don’t know where they’re never going to meet your expectations because they’re not tuned into it. The five are acts of service. So you love it. When somebody does something for you. Somebody does an act of service that really makes you feel good. And touch. So the sensitive touch being intimate, being delicate, being affectionate touches the second gifts to third one is people buying new things and buy new sentiment buying new gift bringing you flowers or aftershave. The fourth is a domain words of endearment or they call a Elbert words of endearment, encouragement, saying nice things compliments. What’s the fair? Oh, no, I’m trying to think now. Quality Time. Ironically, that’s my partner’s languages are quality time. And this is quality time of mine is service. So she does saying for me this morning, when out of all the dogs, because I had a board meeting at like 6:30am. I was like, I just love that and like she’s got up and taking the dogs out, which is my job like that is really important to me. Whereas if I did to her would be wouldn’t be that important. Whereas if I carve out, she calls out 90 minutes for me in an evening to spend some time together. I’m like, that’s okay. But I’d prefer an act of service as well as avoiding that for her. That makes her feel special. So that’s mine and hers. What’s yours? Yeah, so. So I think I had two and I can’t remember which way round it was your primary one and your secondary one. So I think it’s the physical touch. And words of endearment for me. And I just like I say, I can’t remember, but I think probably his words. So words are really important to me. And you know, it, you know, it can like build you up, you can pull you down in my case. And now there’s just an interesting spin on this. I happen to be married twice, I still am married for the second time. And my first wife and I, we had opposite. Love Languages. And, and my current wife, current wife, my wife, she’s still going to be my wife, maybe not as she is. But anyway, we have very similar love languages. So it does make it a bit easier if you similar. You have to work at it. If if you’re different. And I think the transition, you know, maybe and this is we’re talking about romantic relationships, which is great. But it’s similar principles can apply in other types of relationship to I mean, obviously, don’t go around kissing people in a business meeting. But you know, you know, we can apply principles, you know, someone who likes a little touch on the shoulder, for example, but you need to get that right. But, you know, if they like that, then you know, you can make them feel uplifted. So absolutely. It’s always think about having either night vision goggles, or you know, you go to the optician and they put the different lenses in, of course, think the more of these things you can learn. It just gives you more when you communicate with somebody, you’re not just it just gives you a high level of awareness. And obviously, not necessarily talking about taking advantage of the situation or manipulating or anything like that, but more understanding how we will want to go from point A to point B and when we’re doing deals and here and are done number of deals together. The most important thing the only important thing is that you’ve got a number of people involved in the deal. And you’ve got to find that  win-win where everybody’s happy when you can’t understand how to rather than do a deal where people just think about one of my big managers his relationships over transactions is I’ll only ever take 80% of the deal. But I could get another 100 grand here, but another half a million there, if it means I’m going to squeeze the pips out of somebody else, that’s not in check for interest in a buy, I’ve made more money. That’s not how we play the game, it’s relationships over transactions, when you can start to learn that sort of business is real. It’s communicating with different people and understanding how they work. And all you need to do is really develop a huge self-awareness of what is everybody trying to achieve? And what are they thinking? Without saying, that’s when you can really start to operate a very mature or sustainable, lucrative level effect? Because it’s a skill set that not many people have. Yeah, I totally agree. I think so talking about being holistic, I kind of reinvented the wheel, you know, the wheel of life? Yeah. So I’ve developed a built on that, obviously, I didn’t invent it, I just built on it. Mine’s a bit more complicated. It’s got more spokes and more pieces. But basically, it’s kind of holistic planning, you know, self reflection tool. And, you know, you score yourself in each of these different areas, you know, and our whole being, so it’s not just about work and business, or even just your romantic life. There’s other things too. So that’s one example. Another one is that, you know, there’s people are, I like to say, people are icebergs, you know, you’ve only got so much above the surface, and the rest is all beneath the surface. And, you know, we just have to figure out if we can, what’s beneath the surface, because often people, people stated reasons for doing something, saying something behaving a certain way, or taking a decision are not actually reflective of their real true inner motives. So it’s trying to figure that out. So I’m with you about relationships and with you about trying to figure people out, you know, they say the best, best sort of communicators, they want to can sort of make you feel heard in a room. I don’t know if you can hear what’s going on outside my thing here, but I think there’s a helicopter doing circling, hopefully not looking for me. But anyway, so yeah, the whole being Are you right? It’s it’s a skill set softer skills. But I think these softer skills are what differentiates a lot of successful people from not so successful people, whether it’s business people, or just people in any any walk of life, and they are skilled. So there’s very few people who are born with that, because we’ve got adopters or you’ve got understand all the different profiles. There’s some people who are naturally people, people might Blaze profiles, or people who are more sensory, you know, they’re more connected to certain things. But that doesn’t always facilitate a good business ability. And yeah, business. This is like the biggest cliche ever, and I’ve never said it before. But business is is a people thing, isn’t it? It’s like, at a board meeting today, we were doing a national expansion, one of these, one of the companies I’ve invested in, but we’re saying what I said, So what do you think the biggest challenge you’re gonna come up against is going to be on this journey? And what do you think they said? numbers of people because they absolutely, yeah. The team? Is the strategy solid, the business model is solid, the funds are there and the markets perfect. What’s the biggest challenge we’re gonna have? It’s gonna be how do we get a team of people to collaborate, move in the same direction? It’s the hardest? I think it’s the hardest thing? I think it probably is the hardest thing in business at scale, when you get into the CERT teams of like, 3040 50. I think there it really is. Yeah, and I think that’s probably is That danger zone in the middle, when you’re on less than 10? It’s easy, because your mates, when you’re over 100 It’s easy, because you’ve got a seven finger board or six finger executives, when you’re in that scale up space, that’s where I think it gets tough because you are reliant on lots of people culture structure, it’s tough.

Yeah, I agree. It’s tough. And I think, you know, it’s, it’s a complex situation then because, you know, you can have the best plans and strategies, you know, be well funded, have the right product marketing, etc, just to like general business principles, but who’s delivering it, you know, and you know, and you know, you can have a boss who’s just down on the, you know, all their staff and that’s just completely demotivated, start sabotaging things and leaving and all that sort of stuff. And you know, it doesn’t get executed well. And, and a lot of it is about, you know, ego gets in the way of all of us, actually. So I think it all starts with self-awareness actually all starts with self awareness. So if we start with self awareness, we’re aware of ourselves. And then we start to flip it and go, well, obviously that’s looking in the mirror Self Awareness looking in the mirror, but then we can start to look outside through the lens or whatever you want to call it, and other people with a greater understanding of ourselves and then recognizing actually, you know what, they’ve also got that those things going on those motivators, those differentiators those characteristics. And recognizing that they’re different. But, you know, it’s funny enough, I mean, look at just off topic, literally, I think today, they’ve got the Climate Summit, haven’t we been going on these last few days? You know, there’s going to be classic examples there of different, you know, personalities and cultures, and, you know, just personal interests, which are going to get away. If you want to look at a space where a guy is top of the mile. I mean, I listen to seven hours of the House of Commons last week with a budget just to hit all the opposing thoughts. And it’s just embarrassing. You think a war point was singing chants and shaking a new life path? You know, we’re not. We’re not in ancient Rome now. And the Colosseum, it’s 2021 we’re talking about recovery, we sort of are going to global Britain. And we’ve got a group of people buying their chest and shaking newspapers. It’s like, yeah, there’s nothing that we’re still Neanderthal. I mean, we, we, you know, that’s one of the things to always remember, we still got animal instincts, you know, fight-flight, freeze, fawn, you know, type of responses. And, you know, the Chimp Paradox and all that stuff. We, we are instinctive creatures at heart. And whilst we have advanced clearly, you know, we’ve knowledge education, etc. If fundamentally, that’s that, and that’s why sometimes we will get pissed off with one another, you know, because the animal comes to the surface, we get triggered. And you know, we can respond. So that’s something I’m really interested in from personal development, self-development point of view. I love psychology, but I’m not a psychologist if that makes sense. My wife is so that, you know, I’ve got no chance in my house. Basically, I’m busted for everything. So she’s a she’s very good double degree psychologist and a senior HR vice president. So I’ve just, you know, I’ve just done basically leads you got someone to ask the advanced economic, economic, academic questions to on sort of the onboarding of philosophy. So I look more of the why. Well, I don’t know if it’s the why What the hell but it’s like, one of the things that fat fascinates me obsess me, and drives me mental is this whole thing of like why I’m calling tonight? Last month on problems now I’ve taught everyone about the sole purpose. This is the concept of viewing things like whether it’s like religious or Buddhist or like dharmas, or eco guys, and it’s this, this idea that we’re here to do something this why, why? I’ll pose the question to you, I’m sure you consider that is, why are you here? Why did you do what you do? Why, what why? What, Why, why? Why me? Okay. I think it’s, again, it’s one of those voyages of discovery, right. And I think in my case, it’s, um, it’s dual purpose, if that makes sense. But I think it ultimately is probably the same route. So I think I’m here to share my knowledge. But equally, I think I’m here to, you know, give into the next generation. So, you know, everything I do kind of always comes back to that, you know, so what I’m doing now, for example, is, you know, we kind of sorted financially wealth, you know, okay, as a family and the kids are going to be okay, so we’ve kind of hit all those goals. And, you know, next stage really is I’m trying to build a foundation. And so, you know, above a certain level of net worth, is all going to go into this foundation. And I’ve had that it’s been burning inside of me for a couple of decades. And it kind of won’t let me go, it just keeps coming back. And even though I go Do you know what, I just want to sit on a beach and sip cocktails, and do nothing for a while and we talked about that before we go on and how actually exciting that is after a while. But, you know, it’s I think the foundation is really on what I’m building towards. It’s just, it’s my legacy, but and it’s sharing is still sharing, but why sharing knowledge along the way and the other one is, is maybe giving back in a different way when I leave this which we will will so I think that’s for me my purpose, what about you? But I just asked a question that don’t take this long way. This is this is a reflection of me not so nice that I’ve always wanted to do a foundation and then started looking at it and thought there’s why those events a charity, that sort of stuff. So for me Years ago, I started a thing called gap and get back, which is basically an initiative we run every year to promote mental and physical well being in entrepreneurs. Because one of the biggest things that gets in our way is ourselves, we get fat, we get lazy, we get sly, just at the heart of people’s mental and physical world, whereas entrepreneurs that also raise money for charity, we’ve raised about a quarter-million pounds so far over the last three or four years. And on my way of life, Vivier bat, was on a scale to a point where I was donating half million pounds a year. And as I’ve got more self aware, over the last few years about my ego, one of the questions I can’t now get away from is, am I actually doing that? Because I feel like I’m given and I am given that, or is it another thing of my ego of, I feel like I should be I feel like I want to visibly be given, because the very it comes with the territory, philanthropies isn’t that you made money, you get into a good position, and then you start giving back. And I thought, is that just my ego? Or is that actually fundamentally something that I want to do? And it’s like, Have you ever asked yourself that question?

No, absolutely. I think, you know, it’s a good way to test yourself, you know, if you, you know what, I mean, I was reluctant to say, excuse me, because I think once you start articulating that it can sound like a bit of a humblebrag, you know, it can be flipped and used as a PR exercise. So I was trying not to say too much. But interestingly, I was talking to your former team, and we might get onto that. And I was prompted to share my personal vision. And I just, I just touched on it very loosely, like I kind of did that. And I was prompted to share in a bit more detail. And I was a bit uncomfortable, because I you know, I don’t know if you know how far to go with this. But I did. And then of course, it just, it was from the heart. And I had people coming up to me afterwards saying that was so inspiring, you know, and thanks for sharing that. And, you know, things like that. And so I’m trying to be wearing them not sounded, you know, like some big thing or whatever. And equally, I don’t want it I didn’t I didn’t actually personally subscribe to the point that it just goes with the territory. The philanthropy doesn’t always, by the way. But I think, although you look at some of the giving pledge, you know, and I think perhaps is, I mean, that’s a great thing, by the way, the giving pledge to give back into society, but it can be used in, you know, inappropriately, sometimes. But I think what my vision is, So yours is great. I think you’re giving money today, and it’s making a difference today, with your charitable giving. What I’m really trying to do is build like almost a wealth fund. So whether it’s a foundation, a charity, nonprofit, whatever it is, I don’t actually know yet. But I’m hoping it’s going to last for several generations. And, you know, we’ll we’ll, you know, live that live on a bit longer than I could have done. So I think that’s where I really have the vision for it, then the causes that I, you know, want to support. The very close to my heart is financially because they’ve been expanded recently, because my kids have helped me to see a wider, bigger picture, because they’ll see a different generation. And they’ve got, you know, wouldn’t say they’ve got different interest, because when I mentioned what theirs are as LIBOR, of course, you should have that as an interest. But you also have to be can’t do everything for everybody. So yes, I’ve asked myself that question. I’m trying to avoid it being an ego trip, in all honesty, and that’s why in a way I keep the whole he keeps coming back to me, you know, thing is, is really important. And I think it’s a good test of whether it’s your purpose, if it won’t leave you alone, if you feel it just keeps rising up inside of your bloody I’ve got to do something about that. That’s a clue that it is really your core purpose, I think. Yeah. As you’re talking, I think, obviously, in the wider question of the why sort of thing. But being productive, it’s just in my blood, being productive and being creative and problem-solving. And, again, you got we were sound cliche, but same way is easy, but it’s helping people, whether it’s been in my businesses where I’ve taken team members and created cultures where everyone feels invested in and trying to drive them forward. Or if somebody comes to me wants to sell their business or somebody that got an owner money that just sold their company and actually now you know, they used to make in half million pounds a year now they’ve got a couple of million quid they got no, no cash flow. It’s I understand what their problems are. And then one of my skills I think is making things happen is if I say I’m going to get involved in something, I normally if it kills me, I’ll normally execute on that because I made the decision whether I can do it before I go into it. That’s probably my one of my skill sets. I think my reason why. Yeah, then I will this not one of the deepest questions we talked about property entrepreneurs spend three months every year looking at it. And there’s the tangible bit. So my reason why I initially was I came from very humble beginnings, single parent household, and we didn’t have money. So my first thing was, I wanted to get money to give money to my mom, and I wanted to get money to make my dad proud. That was my first thing. And then I got to a point where hopefully, I made my dad proud. And I realized my mom didn’t actually want my money. So she, she basically just said that you’re wasting your time, but by then it was too late. And then I wanted financial independence myself. So I wanted to build my own sort of like financial fortress and have financial independence. So we did that. And then as an owner, then I’ve just been the sole search and re I tried time off couple of years ago, I tried like December off and put my feet up, and I end up fat hungover and we’ve sunstroke sitting on the beach, we ginger hair.

And the other day, and I think one thing that’s come to me recently, which I’m reading some really old scripts, old stuff at the minute, some movies and stuff on a script called the DAT Tao de Ching by Lao Tzu that I’ve ever heard of. It’s like, turn. Yeah, I heard of it. But I haven’t read it. Yet. It’s about 10,000 years old. Anyway, so at four chapters, it’s like an encyclopedia, oh, boy over there. But one of the things they said in there is, don’t die with your music and psychology. And it’s like, that’s something that’s really landed me recently as i What is my music, and I thought, probably entrepreneurs been going for seven or eight years now. And every year, I’ve never tried to scan that I’ve never, every year, it just gets more expensive and more people joy. Because it’s just this blueprint of what I’ve used to get to where I am. And over the last 10 years, I’ve just created a new thing, and then passed it back to other people. And I thought actually, there’s one thing I could leave the world it would be that blueprint finished, done and dusted. So actually, when I’m long gone, I mean, the guys deliver it without me at the minute, but it’s only about 70%. That would be my gift, I think would be that say? I don’t know, I don’t know, the answer to my question was that I was gonna say, You’re fascinating, because, you know, obviously, you spent I know, a lot of time, you know, contemplating purpose and soul, you know, that you mentioned, and you’re still searching yourself. But I mean, to be fair, you know, you’ve got younger than me. And so I think not that need to be a certain age. But because I have been wrestling with that soaping for probably longer, many more years, maybe, you know, starting to appear, maybe, I think the things that we talked about when we’re young, and our aspirations and our outcome goals, you know, like financial independence, get house get married, blah, blah, blah, you know, stuff like that. There, they’re like, everybody’s sorts of milestones in life, there’s no real difference, you know, we still want to be in a relationship in a nice home and, you know, feel that we were fulfilled in our work and things like that, and pretty much everyone’s same. I think the distinguishing part is the bit that it’s not an outcome, actually, it’s a way of life. And this includes you already telling me, I don’t want to be pop psychologist or anything, but there’s a lot of clues in the way you talk and the way that you go about things. And I think, you know, something around the helping people sounds to me, you know, certainly parts of it. And, you know, you’ve got the skills to execute on that. And I’ve seen it firsthand, by the way, you know, you know, when you’ve been working alongside us and supported us, and just the way you talk, you know, you studied and you apply that. And then you’ve got a heart, you want to help the other person to get what they want. You talk about a win, you know, as outcomes, and you will leave money on the table for the sake of relationships. You know, that’s, that’s pointing to slightly different direction, I think. And I think there’s something there. Need to explore? Because that is my big question. When I’m not busy. And I am in my little meditation room on got time to myself, in my head. I’m always thinking like, what is this all about? Anything, any last words of wisdom you could hand out to me to explore that? You know, you’re very fun. The conversations we’ve had one of the things that I’ve credited with is how well rounded and how much like life experience you’ve got both in business but also the softer side of things. You know, when you’re talking about people and appraising situations, you clearly know what and even just like you just spoke about that, you know what he’s talking about? How would you encourage me? You’ve obviously developed to understand and further than I have in this spirit with what What would you encourage me to explore? Or questions? So, I’m not an expert, by the way, I think, you know, maybe I talk a good game. I’m not an expert. So I think for me, you know, it’s been that. So the music inside, right, you said your own quote. So don’t die with the music inside. So you kind of need to tune in literally. So listen, listen to yourself, in different situations, and what keeps recurring, even though you’re in different situations, different events happening with different people, you know, is the Steve Jobs quote, looking back and see if you can join those dots. But on a more practical level, I don’t know if you’ve read a URL well read. So you may well have come across these publications, by the way, the ancient publications are really good. Marcus Aurelius and, you know, the Stoics, all that stuff. And this morning, he read every morning, it’s one of things I believe, from a soul by carried on pay off the practical. What I was gonna say was, maybe a couple of books, you’ve probably come across them. One is the values factor by Dr. John Demartini. Yeah, that’s amazing. Yeah. And that’s, you know if you really dig into values, you know, that’s how you do things, what’s important to you, in? Putting your values up? Yeah, yeah. You know, he had to constantly share. Yeah, I mean, some of them, I think, you know, you know, trust, respect, integrity, integrity is really big for me, you know, actually, you know, that mutual respect, and, you know, giving is another part of it. So, there’s, there’s a couple of them, that are very, very important. So, like, we talked about the love languages, so when respect, you know, and so if the wrong words come out, then that’s not good. They can do from my lips, as well as other people’s integrity, you know, be a person of your word, be trustworthy, deliver on what you say, you know, it’s really important to me, but I also judge other people by the same value, by definition, but isn’t necessarily the value. So sometimes bit unfair, you know, so there’s a big lost in tech, she is the leader and a business owner and investor and a manager when, yeah, judging other people by your own standards, especially when you’re a perfectionist and a high performer, it’s very exhausting place to be as a senior person. I mean, I’ve had some therapy around, you know, dropping expectations and stuff like that, you know, so you know, that, that, as you rightly say it, you set your own bar quite high, and then you will end up judging people by the same bar, but perhaps even a higher bar, and that’s going to get you in a lot of trouble. So anyway, I think it’s not fair on anyone else, even if, yeah, if you are gardener by Marian standards, it’s like, we’re very different people with very different aspirations in life.

The only one is, there’s another book called What matters most. So when people talk about purpose, that’s my go to recommendation. People talk about Simon Sinek, you know, start with why, but I prefer what matters most, because it’s very practical at helping you uncover you know, your purpose, but there’s a load the load of other things that we could dive into, but there’s just a couple, but I just think listening. So for example, I spent a lot of soul searching times I’ve been through several phases of Korea, you know, corporate land consultancy, business ownership investor, and possibly rotating them again, and, and the different and like, I see, will that work? That didn’t work. I like that. I didn’t like that, you know, this thing keeps recurring. Why? Why is that? Why is this thing? So I don’t know. It is a case of listening. And if you’re not so good, I’m not always so good at listening to myself, you know, tuning in, it’s great to have someone you can talk at and, you know, they can play that foil. I wasn’t joking about having therapy. I think I was talking to know Stephen Schwarzman sportsman. That’s right. Isn’t it? Blackstone, his biography he talks about he’s seen a psychologist for like decades. And I was surprised to hear him say that in his autobiography. But I think lots of people should, it shouldn’t be a taboo subject. And you know, not doesn’t mean you need, you know, whatever fixing or whatever. But it should be helpful to talk to someone who, especially someone who’s skilled, can uncover and dig into certain things that you maybe don’t even realize you’re revealing. Definitely. I mean, for those who listen, as you might think, you know, the all these things sound quite extreme. If you want to go to the extreme and you want to see what you’re capable of. You also need to understand who you are. I’ve had therapy I’ve had hypnotherapy was hypnotized last year, and it was one of the most life changing things I’ve ever done. I want you to understand Why my work ethic was so high, because I couldn’t figure out why I still, you know, build the businesses, then the sole some companies then made some model or made some money. And I can understand why I kept wanting to go at the same pace. And all these nothing changes. Anyway, it took me back to my childhood, and found two reasons why. And he answered it for me, and it changed my life. And then I pay for all of our board members to have life coach at the same life coach design path for like, three, four years. And it’s just, every time every, every phone call, it’s only half an hour a month, but it’s always life changing. And it’s, if you spin at the bottom rung of the ladder, and hit the top of the ladder at the bottom, that’s one of them. I’ve got a couple of questions for you. Oh, have you heard Okay, okay, cool, different. You can think of me as quick or they can be quick ones. When we’re talking about productivity and being busy, so you and I are both busy people, you know, I think we like for whatever reason, we like that lifestyle, that pace of life. And obviously, sometimes it’s sometimes it doesn’t always, sometimes it can be at our own cost. And it can overcook us a little bit. Why do you think why that? Oh, why? Why did you? Do it’s hard for me to, you know, call it for you. But I might have a suspicion but I don’t know. Well, okay, this is Whoa, okay. I’m a very honest person. And it’s hard for me not to say something when there’s some. There’s an honest revelation there. Sometimes it gets me in trouble, by the way. But recently, I did discover I had a condition, which clearly I’ve had for many a decade. And I didn’t know, I had a certain condition until it was recently diagnosed. And it comes with the condition. Sorry, I understand. And now I’m like, Okay, now it makes sense. It’s actually a release, it’s likely to release. And now it’s a joke, right? Oh, it’s because of my condition. And, you know, blah, blah. And, you know, and I am wired, you know, I am always on the go, I’m, you know, I’m always, you know, moving towards new things, as well. So it’s all kind of characteristic with that. And it kind of, it’s a piece of the puzzle that I didn’t have. I mean, if I’m 55 I’m 55. And I didn’t know, I just did not know, I mean, God forbid, you know, people around me who survived around me for however many decades, you know, and I’m thinking back to the moments going, okay, yeah, that wasn’t so great. That wasn’t great. And I can pinpoint it to this common thread, so don’t really want to spill it, spill it all out right now.

But we’re not astounded. I mean, that’s, I wouldn’t be surprised if, obviously, there’s all sorts of spectrums. And I won’t be surprised if I appear on some or many of them in different capacity. I mean, my partner’s convinced I’ve got OCD convinced I’ve got some sort of ADHD, I’m just constantly like, my brain is a million miles out past that shut up with a woman who wake up at one in the morning. You can’t put me back to bed. It’s like, I’ll just lay here for five hours. Do you see that? Say that? So that’s it because of your condition and you’ve gone into that space? Do you ever challenge it regard yourself and think I shouldn’t be doing this, I shouldn’t be sitting on a beach. I shouldn’t be chilled out I should be doing a 10 two, three or 95? Are you quite contented and happy going on guns razor? I think I used to challenge it and question it and think why me? Why am I doing this? Why can’t I just chill out and you know, I’ll you know, even I took a three week vacation, I had a business partner times back in the 90s. And I could not stop checking in with a business. And you know, we who’s the Chairman, my business partner, just he basically went around one by one shutting people down talking to me. And it was the most stressful thing you can imagine. For me. I was on a bloody beach trying to relax. But I was actually stressed because I couldn’t have the direct communication. And even if there was a problem, I would feel more relaxed knowing about it than just not knowing so I think but now I have the answer to that. And now I’m more chilled with it. And I kind of go with it. And I can’t forgive myself. You know, and I’m more accepting of myself. Because now I know which characteristic of me to fix because other people will be listening to this either thinking where we sound are absolutely nuts or fits thinking, wow, that’s exactly how it worth it. One concept that came to me a couple of years ago, which I think is really interesting. I’d be interested to hear your thoughts since you got work-life balance that everybody talks about, which is when to start weekends off or weeks holiday And then this thing called Work-Life blend, which is more like, actually, there is no black and white, it’s just gray. And it’s like you could be on holiday, but you might do an hour work in the morning, because that’s how you actually, if I’d rather go for three days, or four days off the grid, long weekend holiday, don’t do any work, or seven days with two hours work in the morning just to dip in. And it’s not really work. It’s checking into work, I feel like, you know, I’m looking after the kids or whatever something you want. I’m assuming your work-life blends and your work-life balance. No doubt. One extreme example just doesn’t make you feel good. Now, you know, I really struggle with that. And sometimes people around me struggle with it too, because maybe they want to switch off. And you know, I’m on the go. And like, it’s really funny, because you just said something along the lines of it doesn’t feel like work or isn’t really work or something like that. And that’s how I feel. Sometimes I’ve got, I’ve got my laptop on my lap, obviously, in the lounge, I’m always there. And we’re going to there’s something in the background on TV, and I’m kind of tapping away. And she said, Are you working on like, no. But I think what’s the definition? I think probably I am. Yeah, I’m working on an article, for example, that’s still kind of build in my knowledge. And you know, maybe I’m doing it because I want to translate that into someone else. So yeah, I don’t get busted every time. Like I say, so. Definitely. What about you? Exactly the same. I mean, I work with entrepreneurs all day long, whether they’re in companies I invest in, or people that we train other board members who are on the same boards as way and we’re all the same. It’s like it’s not, it does not work. It’s, in fact, we sent it to one of my fellow board members every day, and was he was saying about going to a wedding. And they say, I seen How late did you stay silent or whether now that weekend and left at 7pm. So nothing good is gonna happen after 7pm I’m gonna end up in Tahoe going up drunk or drinking next day is going to be a little bit foggy. I’d rather go to the web and have a great time enjoy everyone’s company. And when people start shouting at you and saying the same thing twice, we’ll leave and we’re saying actually, sometimes. And this is not, if my friends and family listen to this, this doesn’t apply to them. But sometimes going to a social environment, or somewhere where you’ve fought forced to make small talk, can feel far more laborious to me than going and sit in the office for a day. I could say on a Saturday or Sunday, doing deals or sending WhatsApp or whatever, and find it far more enjoyable. So I’m definitely more of a blend, don’t get up, bang out two hours and then go off to the beach or go out to lunch. Keep it moving. We have to be a little bit careful. I think Elon Musk said in his autobiography. But there was a question he raised his 11 hours a week enough for a girlfriend.

I don’t know if you ask many girls that question. I’m not sure that they’re gonna agree with it. So definitely part of it is you’ve got to if somebody is you’ve got to want to be in relation with an entrepreneur. There’s no, you can’t, you can’t compromise it. He’s lovely. But he’s an entrepreneur. That’s never gonna work. It’s like he’s lovely, because he’s an entrepreneur. Exactly. So what was your second question? And did you want to dive more into that one? Because that was kind of big. Right. I think it I think it’s Yeah, I think it’s fascinating. I think it’s there is? Yeah. So out it so it is ADHD in my case. I have less of the age, if that makes sense. There’s a few there’s a spectrum, basically, like, you find out you’ve had it because I literally my family have been saying instances about six. What now is so funny, no one ever suggested it ever, for any reason, even though they’re probably quite a lot of clues through our lots of experiences and encounters, but I’ll tell you what it was and it’s the lady who does my podcast actually has me saying this. She and we had had a call. And she said, Yeah, I think she’s out about her condition. She said she has ADHD. And she said, I suspect you might have to. And this was fairly recent this year. All right. I was like, Oh, really, you know, I mean, I don’t take any offense by anyone who’s saying anything like that I’d take on board, you know, feedback. And I was like, Okay, I’ll do some background research. And of course, you know, looked up about 50 Google articles, you know, Google 50 articles popped up. I was like, I don’t see I don’t associate it with the age the hyperactivity bit. And that was my preconceived idea of the condition as well. You know, someone just can’t control themselves bounce off the walls type of thing. And, you know, I think I can relatively but not it all the time, obviously. But I associated with a lot of stuff. I was like, oh, okay, it could be something in this. And then I basically took it. I told you I actually speak to a psychologist every week. And I took it into her and she went out because there’s a few tests in fact, sorry. Go ahead. Now Oh, yeah, you got tests. And I wouldn’t be surprised if a lot of entrepreneurs have those sort of traits, you know, active more. Elon Musk says he, when he was a kid, he thought he was insane. He thought he actually thought he was insane. Because his brains would stop. And I thought I can No, yeah, it would never stop. You know, Elon Musk has got Asperger’s. Right. Yeah. Well, that. I mean, that was quite new thing. So I don’t know whether it’s the new thing. He’s probably had it forever. But I know he’s only just recently sort of, now’s I’ll send I’ll put a link in the show notes as a test that some funniness someone and another group shared, which has got a lot of different tests. So, tests for autism test for ADHD and a couple of similar sorts of conditions. And it’s kind of you know, it’s obviously a self scoring test, you could influence it if you wanted it to wanted to, but what would be the point, and then it just gives you, you might have a tendency to, and maybe you want to look into that type of thing? If you share that with me, and what’s amazing. Also, I’ve got a soul test, which tells you how old your soul is, do you think, do you think your soul we think about the soul is like, your body is just the physical life and hopefully the end of this the soul carries on and we get reincarnated or whatever. Would you say you’re an old soul, young soul? Oh, what were you put into in terms of the universe? And you know that we could be reincarnated? It’s going to be hard to answer that. I feel like I’m young at heart. Definitely. But I do feel that. I said, No, I don’t know. I don’t know the answer to that one. But so I’ll take the test, I’ll take the test. And be interested, say, I feel like I’m young at heart. But equally, I do feel that I seek wisdom. And I you know, try and impart wisdom. I mean, that’s maybe self a humble brag. And I don’t mean it sound like that. But, you know, I search it out. And I try and impart it to other people, if I hear you know, good stuff, but not what’s your soul age? Did you do

off the scale, and he lies owners, they have not been here before. Not interested in the cars and the jewelry and the small talk, I’m on a mission out the way. Big things that be things to solve. They’re like, yeah, don’t sweat the small stuff. And be I’ve always known, I’ve known that for a long time anyway. Seek wisdom overwhelmed, you know, all these sort of things are int