280. The Story of Money feat. Frederick Kaufman

Money is a mirage, and the harder and deeper you look into it, the hazier it can become. It is a human construct, a tool that we have all agreed to hold value in so that we can exchange it with each other for goods and services, but what is it really? How did we all come to agree on this abstract thing together, and where does it go from here?

Frederick Kaufman is a journalist, professor of English and Journalism at the City University of New York, and an author. His latest book is called The Money Plot, and explores the story of how money has been developed and used in human cultures as a narrative, and uses that narrative to reveal a deeper understanding of this human construct we all use.

Frederick and Greg discuss Frederick's connections and history coming through journalism to the areas of both food and money, as well as their surprising connections to each other. Frederick addresses some of the longstanding myths of the history of money and reveals some of the falsehoods and what the realities are instead. They talk about how looking at finance through the eyes of an English professor can show things that the typical finance-minded person would miss.

*unSILOed Podcast is produced by University FM.*

Episode Quotes:

How is establishing a narrative the same as establishing a currency?

31:41: Once you can establish the context for trading and establishing, this is our currency. That's where the money is. And that's precisely similar to establishing any narrative. Once we establish the grounds of a narrative, a Christian narrative, for instance, then we understand our basis for meaning. The same thing here. Once we understand that commodity narrative, that's where we make money. The problem is to make other people believe it.

How Wall Street makes its living

18:59: This is how Wall Street makes its living: through derivative trades and through understanding metaphors upon metaphors, upon metaphors. And they are, in my estimation, better poets than anybody out there today. I say the guy who's trading in derivatives, the guy who's an options trader, the guy who's using the Black-Scholes theorem to price options, really understands the ethereal realm of the sublime better than any other poet out there.

What lies underneath the narrative of money

02:17: I think, ultimately, the point of the book is that we have to remember that stories do define us, and we have to remember that it's about us. It's about humans, about human bodies, about human shelter, and about human need. All those things have to come first. We cannot be the victims of the stories that we tell.

Public vs. private realm

53:18: When everything that was in the private realm is now in the public realm, what the hell is it that we got? What do we have anymore that defines me? And the answer is increasingly, nothing.

Show Links:Recommended Resources:

• Adam Smith
• Alfred Kroeber
• Rai Stones

Guest Profile:

• Faculty Profile at CUNY
• Frederick Kaufman’s Website
• Frederick Kaufman on Twitter

His Work:

• Articles on Men’s Health
• The Money Plot: A History of Currency's Power to Enchant, Control, and Manipulate
• Bet the Farm: How Food Stopped Being Food
• A Short History of the American Stomach