45. The Passible Mormon-Jesus: From New Age Seances to Loving Executions

In this episode, Brendon and Skyler discuss the forty-fifth lesson in the LDS Come, Follow Me sunday school manual. This week (Oct. 30 – Nov. 5) is titled “Jesus Christ, ‘the Author of Eternal Salvation’” and covers Hebrews 1-6. 

We invite you to worship with us on any Sunday - either at First Baptist Church of Provo or Christ Presbyterian Church in Magna. We welcome visitors!  

Pastor Brendon's Colossians series can be found here and/or here. 

Correction (of a silly mistake): JS was assassinated on June 27,1844.

Individual and Families; Sunday School (Holland video at bottom; also here) 

Gospel Principles and here 

2 Ne. 2.7, 9.7,26, 25.16; Mosiah 13.28,34; Alma 34.8-12, 42.15,21-31; Mos. 1.33, 3.1-9; D&C 20.17,28; 76; 77.3; 93; 132 

True to the Faith, under “Atonement”, regardless of substitutionary language states things like: “To receive this gift, we must meet certain requirements”; and “Through your faith and righteousness and through His atoning sacrifice, all the inequities, injuries, and pains of this life can be fully compensated for and made right.” 

“The Light of Christ” (Boyd Packer) 

“Atonement of Jesus Christ” (Encyclopedia of Mormonism);“The Only True God and Jesus Christ Whom He Hath Sent” (Jeffrey Holland) 

The Lectures on Faith 

The New Testament Made Easier by David Ridges 

The Words of Joseph Smith compiled and edited by Andrew Ehat and Lyndon Cook 

• “Christ, who is the image of man, Is also the express image of his Father’s person. So says Paul. For in him, Christ, dwelt ‘the fulness of the Godhead bodily’. Why? Because he was ‘the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person.’ What person? God’s person.” (p.231) 
• “But the holy ghost is yet a Spiritual body and waiting to take himself a body. As the Savior did or as god did or the gods before them took bodies...” (June 16, 1844; p. 382) 
• “Joseph also said that the Holy Ghost is now in a state of Probation which if he should perform in righteousness he may pass through the same or a similar course of things that the Son has.” (August 27, 1843; p. 245) 

Joseph Smith: here and here ; The Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pp. 38-40 

Joseph Smith told Alexander Neibaur that he saw Jesus with a light complexion (white skin) and blue eyes (A.N. Journal, May 24,1844) - thus, looking a lot like...Joseph Smith. Whiteness is also true of Mary in 1 Nephi 11.13-15, who is even claimed by some LDS to actually be from England, based on legend. 

Statements of the LDS First Presidency compiled by Gary Bergera 

• “Christ’s supreme sacrifice can find full fruition in our lives only as we accept the invitation to follow Him. This call is not irrelevant, unrealistic, or impossible. To follow an individual means to watch him or listen to him closely; to accept his authority, to take him as a leader, and to obey him; to support and advocate his ideas; and to take him as a model. Each of us can accept this challenge.” (Howard W. Hunter, “First Presidency Message”, Ensign, Sept. 1994) 

Michael as Adam is agreed upon by all sides of Mormonism.

Brigham Young: JD 1.50-51; 4.53-54; 4.215-220; 13.309; 14.71-72 

Amasa Lyman: JD 3.140f; 3.164-177, 213f; 7.296-299 

Jedediah M. Grant: JD 1.346; 4.49-51 (Notice the condemnations of occult practices that would include their prophet, Joseph Smith) 

Orson Hyde: JD 4.259f 

Preface to JD 8 states: "The Journal of Discourses deservedly ranks as one of the standard works of the Church, and every rightminded Saint will certainly welcome with joy every Number as it comes forth from the press as an additional reflector of 'the light that shines from Zion's hill.'"

Brigham Young stated:

• "I have never yet preached a sermon and sent it out to the children of men, that they may not call Scripture." (JD 13.95)
• "when they are copied and approved by me they are as good scripture as is couched in this Bible" (JD 13.264)
• 
  

Young stated in a "Discourse on Marriage" that: "Some years ago I advanced a doctrine with regard to Adam being our Father and our God. That will be a curse to many of the elders of Israel because of their folly with regard to it...It is one of the most glorious revealments of the economy of heaven, yet the world hold it in derision. Had I revealed the doctrine of the baptism for the dead instead [of] Joseph Smith, there are men around me who would have ridiculed the idea until doomsday, but they are ignorant and stupid, like the dumb ass."

The Mediation and Atonement by John Taylor 

A Rational Theology; Evidences and Reconciliations by John Widtsoe 

Mormon Doctrine by Bruce R. McConkie 

Understanding Paul by Richard Lloyd Anderson 

 

Epistle To the Hebrews by Richard Draper and Michael Rhodes 

A Gospel Trilogy; The First 2,000 Years by Cleon Skousen 

Exploring Mormon Thought: Volume 2, The Problems of Theism and the Love of God by Blake Ostler 

“The Doctrine of the Firstborn and Only Begotten” by Rodney Turner 

“The ‘Moral’ Atonement as a Mormon Interpretation” by Lorin Hansen 

 

Jason Wallace: here, here, here and here 

No Man Knows My History by Fawn Brodie 

An Insider’s View of Mormon Origins by Grant Palmer 

“Early American Influences on the Book of Mormon” by Thomas E. Donofrio 

The Mound Builder Myth by Jason Colavito 

Conflict in the Quorum by Gary Bergera 

Brigham Young: Pioneer Prophet; The Mormon Jesus by John Turner 

 

The Thirteenth Apostle: The Diaries of Amasa M. Lyman, 1832-1877 edited by Scott Partridge (also here) 

The Ritualization of Mormon History and Other Essays by Davis Bitton

“Amasa Lyman, The Spiritualist”; “From Apostle to Apostate: The Personal Struggle of Amasa Mason Lyman” by Loretta L. Hefner 

Early Mormonism and the Magic World View; The Mormon Hierarchy: Origins of Power; The Mormon Hierarchy: Extensions of Power; “LDS Church Authority and New Plural Marriages, 1890-1904" by D. Michael Quinn 

Like a Fiery Meteor: The Life of Joseph F. Smith by Stephen Taysom 

The Mormon Jesus by John Turner 

Wayward Saints by Ronald Walker 

The Mountain Meadows Massacre by Juanita Brooks (also here) 

Blood of the Prophets: Brigham Young and the Massacre at Mountain Meadows by Will Bagley

“This Is My Doctrine”: The Development of Mormon Theology by Charles Harrell 

Mormonism: Shadow or Reality? By Jerald and Sandra Tanner 

 

Christianity and Liberalism; The Person of Jesus by J. Gresham Machen 

The Gospel According to John (PNTC); The Gagging of God by D.A. Carson 

The Cross and the Prodigal by Kenneth Bailey 

The Apostolic Preaching of the Cross by Leon Morris 

Justin Peters (including a Todd White clip making the point that Holland makes) 

 

Hebrews (NIV Application Commentary) by George Guthrie 

The Forgotten Trinity by James White; Simply Trinity by Matthew Barrett 

Divine Discourse in the Epistle to the Hebrews by Madison Pierce 

The Royal Priest by Matthew Emadi 

The Temple and the Church’s Mission by G.K. Beale 

 

Ancient Greek Religion by H.J. Rose 

Plutarch and His Intellectual World by Judith Mossman 

Destroyer of the Gods by Larry Hurtado 

Moralia by Plutarch; “Isis and Osiris” 

The Cross Before Constantine by Bruce Longenecker 

Plutarch and History by Christopher Pelling