The Chronically Under Touched

This is a LIVE replay (edits made due to technical difficulties) of A Trauma Survivor Thriver's Podcast which aired Tuesday, June 13th, 2023 at 1130am ET on Fireside Chat. Today’s guest is Aaron Johnson, Co-Founder of Holistic Resistance and Grief to Action and Creator of The Chronically Under Touched Project.

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Lorilee Binstock  00:00:43 
Welcome. I'm Lorilee Binstock and this is A Trauma Survivor Thriver's Podcast.
Thank you so much for joining me live on Fireside Chat, where you can be a part of the conversation
as my virtual audience.
I'm Lorilee Binstock, your host. Everyone has an opportunity to ask me or our guest questions by requesting to hop on stage
or sending a message in the chat box. I will try to get to everybody, but I do ask that everyone be respectful.
Today's guest is Aaron Johnson, creator of the chronically under touched project and cofounder of the holistic resistance and grief to action.
Aaron, thank you so much for joining me today.
Can you hear me okay?

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:01:50 
It's good to

Lorilee Binstock  00:01:52 
Hello, Aaron?

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:01:52 
it's little soft, but I can hear you better now.

Lorilee Binstock  00:01:54 
Oh, you can hear
let me make sure you can hear me just fine. Is

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:01:59 
I'll get you now. Yeah. That's great.

Lorilee Binstock  00:02:00 
Oh, good. Good. Good. Awesome. Well, thank you so much for joining me today. I really appreciate it.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:02:06 
No. It's good to be here.

Lorilee Binstock  00:02:07 
I
I know it's it's you typically, we have our shows on Wednesdays, but, you know, it's one of those weeks where if my kids lost last day last day of school tomorrow, and I didn't realize they'll be getting out extra early because they typically get out early on Wednesdays. I am very excited to have you on, and I wanna talk a little bit about the
chronically under touch project.
Could you talk a little bit about that?

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:02:32 
Yeah. It's probably one of the most ambitious projects I have
entered into over the last seven years, and
it's a project that's really tracking.
Right now, I'm focusing on African heritage men because of their how they're targeted, but we've expanded and worked with a lot of folks, but it's really about
tracking the magnitude, the impact of being chronically under touched. And how it bleeds into mental health. It bleeds into
complication on the cassette and
relationship spaces.
It it it impacts folks in that are incarcerated,
folks that can be arrested because of their chronic index trauma stories and how it manifest in their lives. And then how oppression kinda doubles down on that. And so the Crokonetouch project is me
slowing down in community.
What it means to build a comprehensive touch plan
for a body in this context in this moment. I'm working heavily with this young black man, how we build a photonic
comprehensive touch plan for them, and where where do they go? How do we build it? How do we get ahead of it? How do we even introduce the idea? So it's a it's a big project, but it's it's really
profoundly impacting my life and the folks I'm able to work with.

Lorilee Binstock  00:03:44 
Amazing. Well, can you talk what do you mean when you when you say
chronically undertouched?

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:03:51 
Yeah.
So there's a couple ways we track it.
I would say a big portion of population is chronic and in touch, but we with the spectrum that was all extreme, my first kind of birth the phrase and kind of really understood the magnitude of what happens to a body and to individual that is crunching a touch. It was a young man I was working with seven years ago, and he
Me and him were in this, like, mentorship. I was mentoring him, and I was trying to bring him to a space of balance. And we were in arguments almost daily. I remember sitting down with him one day trying to find a groundings base. And I said, you know, when was the last time you had thoughtful platonic touch
over the last twelve months for three minutes?
Hey, Seth there. Now maybe I'm sitting there and going,
I can't think of three minutes in the last twelve months that I've received thoughtful, photonic
touch.
And as extreme as that might actually feel,
that was actually pretty normal.
For a lot of folks I met thereafter.
Is that being under touch
on that extreme level? You can't even think of three minutes of thoughtful platonic continuous touch,
that would be that would be a pretty heavy level. And I would say, you know, average person
would need
for just nervous and balance fifteen minutes of thoughtful but tonic touch, and many folks qualify there of not getting that. So there's a way of just tracking the
the impact of on different bodies, different demographics, the economic levels, the impact. But the for him, I would say, anyone that's in that level of three minutes a year or less, that's extreme, but that's that's chronic, and that's serious. And we need to get to get ahead of that and build some thinking around it.

Lorilee Binstock  00:05:33 
And do you mean
hugging,
hand holding? Is it consecutive?

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:05:39 
Yeah. We want I mean, ideally,
is consecutive. Right? Ideally, we are dealing with folks that it's it's it's continuous for three minutes. I mean, most hugs are five to eight seconds, and so it would take a lot of hugs to get to the three minute mark. So I think for me being able to realize hand holding is one of our common entry points for a lot of the people I work with, we just practice

Lorilee Binstock  00:05:49 
Mhmm.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:06:01 
simple hand holding and and holding attention to our bodies in that process. So handhold is a common way.
We often have a sit and hold hands because the trauma story of walking and holding hands is black sis, and and the chronic ways is really complicated. My culture is still sitting and dropping to our bodies in more meditative space is the most common way we have been able to build thoughtful touch plan for folks, but it also goes shoulder to shoulder back to back, cuddling all those are advanced, but we we start with the handholding typically in our in our program.

Lorilee Binstock  00:06:29 
I wonder, like, as as an adult, I'm thinking. Am I am I am I touched for three minutes at a time?
And and it's interesting when you you talk about touch and how important it is because, you know you know, when your your child is born or when a child is born, they, you know,
most I mean, not necessarily hospitals, but, you know, let's say, for me, I worked with Adula, and the first thing they they talk about is putting the child on your body. How important it is to

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:06:56 
Yep.

Lorilee Binstock  00:06:59 
to have that release of oxytocin.
And and I guess that's that's the same way as adults, but we don't really think about it that way.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:07:07 
No. Unfortunately,
and and working full time and having bigger trans players can push us out of even though it's in the magnitude of what happens over time.

Lorilee Binstock  00:07:16 
Wow.
Well, I wanna get back to that a little bit more, but you are also the cofounder
of the holistic
resistance
and grief to action.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:07:25 
Yes.

Lorilee Binstock  00:07:26 
Can you talk a little bit about the holistic resistance and and your purpose?

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:07:27 
Yeah.
Yeah. Holistic resistance is the umbrella org.
It really supports
our nonprofit arm of grief to action, and it definitely is helping fund and organize
the cut project, holistic resistance is our oldest
organization,
and
it does
some specific things. Holistic resistance is about
dismancing oppression at every level. We realized that
we can't take it all on, but we really wanted to notice that oppression hits the the nervous system hits the body, hits the community, hits you know, so we realized I remember I was sitting in the car, and we were talking with the fellow activists, and they were expressing there in college at the time was like, Erin, I'm doing all the right things.
I'm I'm going to college. I'm trying to and the impression still comment
It's like I'm holistically oppressed and I remember looking at them going. We have to holistically resist,
and we both froze. Like, Wait a minute. What did you say? I said, holistically resist. Write down. Write down. Write down. Hosting resist. And we really thought about it for a couple of months and said, like, what does it mean to resist with our money? To resist with our care for the environment, to resist with our relationships,
to resist with how we eat our food, not that we can nail it every single time, but it's tracking all the ways that Oh, question can come for us how do we push back? And so, mostly, holistic resistance is a
the economic structure is it teaches workshops. And we do consulting. We do one on one programs, and we do facilitate training programs. And so in that, that's kind of the the entry point into
this mounting oppression, but we also do song circles, which is a profound place for us to be reclaimed the voice. And we do a lot of encouragement around natural building, minimalist living, I live in a tiny house. The host of resistance says, how can we find simple, practical, accessible ways
to build village around this mounting oppression? That's kind of the the the mission statement and the marching orders that we we we walk and go forth with holistic resistance.

Lorilee Binstock  00:09:24 
Well, how do you do that? I can imagine. That's a that's a

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:09:27 
Yeah.

Lorilee Binstock  00:09:28 
in in in the world we're living right now. And right now, it it
that's quite a challenge and and and quite a mission.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:09:36 
Yeah.
Yeah. It will we will we wanna be practical about it. Right? We're not we're not gonna be
on every day to we I I remember I was in film school, and I was talking to my film director, and we were like, well, March the worst is, like, twenty on years ago. Walmart's the worst. You don't wanna get anything from Walmart. Now they're like
what? By the time we're like, Walmart's the worst, and he's like, you know, but they have cameras or really good prices.
As a radical filmmaker, go buy a camera from Walmart and make a good documentary,
even if you're taking Walmart, use the system at times,
when you have to. Right? You're you're a, you know, a broke college student. You need to make a camera. Don't not go to Walmart and buy your camera. Go buy it, and then go make your bomb film, and then make that film
Guirteenth in Walmart.

Lorilee Binstock  00:10:25 
Yep. Well, you know, that's interesting my friends used to because my that I have friends who
have issues with certain companies,
and they won't they won't purchase, but there are those moments where they're just like they have to. Right?

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:10:35 
I have a small footprint.
Yeah. You know, you can be in apartment. You can be in the house, but the idea is that we're just we're working constantly orient ourselves.

Lorilee Binstock  00:10:38 
Mhmm.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:10:44 
As accessible to be aware of oppression. When we can step forward and make a big move, we do. I would say if you have five million dollars, donate it if you have five dollars on it, it's all towards the same dismantling. Is we do what we are able to do and not try and get too much to a high stance. So I just just just really being able to track and just notice
how a person shows up and how you can live a lifestyle continuously to adjust
against it when it makes sense for your nervous system and your lifestyle that that you can do. So that's the That's the I'm not here to tell people to sell their house and move to off grid spaces in order to be host resistance. It's not at all. It's more about finding that space of, like, I wanna be a part I wanna make sure I'm resisting, not just in my marching, not just in my donations, not just in my cow, obviously, my kids, but we're trying doing all the ways I possibly can. We're trying to have a a more holistic approach to a dismantling no question.

Lorilee Binstock  00:11:34 
Well, I wanted to talk about and you focus on
African Americans
specifically African American men and the LGBTQ

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:11:43 
Mhmm.

Lorilee Binstock  00:11:45 
plus
communities.
Would that is that something that you thought

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:11:50 
Yes.

Lorilee Binstock  00:11:54 
was extremely important to you?

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:11:57 
It's the hardest group to reach for often times with it comes to building out ecosystems of any kind of
resistant structure.
Those that are targeted by oppression
oftentimes
have
less
money resource, less time. They're they're really busy surviving oppression. So trying to focus on them as a
group we support and allied ship with, we found to be a good starting point. How we supported white folks in this work, of course, how we supported
Latinx folks in this work and all of the people at low majority we definitely have, but we find that
Even though I'm a black man,
I will have three gatherings
in a given year, and two be African heritage ones, and the the ones that are the biggest economic
investment oftentimes gathering people to low majority in African agriculture specifically just because they have to, like,
get childcare and navigate oppression and travel costs country, like, there's a way that we have to just track them. And so I always start with the group that I find is oftentimes
the hardest access to. If I say a cuddle party
and say, anywhere in California,
I'll get thirty white folks to show up to that event. If I say cut a party and say black men,
We got you know, we'll get five, and that's a crowd. Right? And we'll get eight, and that's that's you're winning because it's such a a targeted space. So I know I can have a club authority in the prom anywhere in the West Coast and have thirty white women show up.

Lorilee Binstock  00:13:15 
Yeah.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:13:24 
And, one, maybe queer, personal global majority, and maybe African heritage. And I could also have a couple of partner I'm not gonna hardcore for, and I'll get five black men going out. I'm gonna try this out. This seems kinda strange because I've never seen it before. I'm gonna try, like, we just try and track those groups if this becomes a high calorie burn from the show up and believe it happens because we see more if I have a boxing club or a basketball club or a wrestling club or some kind of after kind of aggressive sport, we can crowd that with black male bodies and and and male bodies. But when you say tenderness, you wanna say closeness, you wanna say cuddles,

Lorilee Binstock  00:13:37 
Mhmm.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:13:56 
cuddles and black men by us on Google, but now now you're talking about things you cannot Google. I can Google black men even be executed
in the street, but I cannot Google
Tusa black men sitting in a public space just tentatively being with each other in the United States. Outside this country is more common, but in the United States, Now you're talking about it really bad o'clock.

Lorilee Binstock  00:14:15 
Well, how do you reach out to those groups,
the LGBT groups, and the African American
men specifically
for
something
of, like, a cuttle party, and I wanna get to that too. I wanted to know more about the the cuddle party, but how are you reaching out?

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:14:29 
Yeah.
Yeah. So
holistic existence was born out of mentorship program. So we were mentoring black men. So I already had a critical mass of black men that I had mentioned over the years. And so I kind of started with those folks that I already were working with, and my mentorship group was more about, like, how to keep them out of jail,
how to get them jobs, how to get them cars, how to get them, like, this but, you know, their your feet under them to keep going into society. So that was a that kinda that that is a crowded field. When you say mentorship, that is the actual profile. Credit field. So then I'm not filled where you got them all in one space. This organically from the years of doing this work, I mentor for almost fifteen years before I birthed, holistic resistance.
When I did that, I had a little bit of a a color profile,
and then I
in in touring. So I'm on tour right now. So I'm traveling.
Like, tonight, I'm flying to Colorado.
I'll be in Denver, and I'm going after after Denver four days, I'll be in North Carolina from North Carolina back in Los Angeles.
Working with three black men project with Resma, Menacom. And and so for me, I am I am literally going to Denver. I'm getting three black men to connect with.
The East Coast, I get twenty. Then I go LA up, but I get a hundred and twenty hopefully. Right? So I I'm really going to where they're gathering in presenting my my idea and a practice, and and out of a hundred men, you'll get ten up. Like, I'm into it. And oftentimes, who have been a big ally is
black women. Black women have had been partnered with black men. They're they're hearing about my project. They're going, my husband needs to talk to you. My son needs to talk to you. My my brother has talked to you. So black women have been by far the biggest supporters of the Kroger Touch project, and, also, other folks are in, like, mixed relationships.

Lorilee Binstock  00:16:00 
Mhmm.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:16:10 
I just talked to a person who's in my silently treat this weekend.
That says, I have a partner. He's dark, but he's not out there. He's just Latin American, but his dark I see his Tucano. I didn't advise Tucano,
and he's dark,
and
he could use his program. So there's a way that a lot of partners are coming to me. I I I I think that would be if I would say that what's the secret ingredient to making it work right now is black women.
Black women are are really the champions of spreading the word. I'm getting more text and calls and emails from black women. And about their partners and or or or from the black man because their partner, you need to call you need to email him there. She email the cut project. It does stop getting this support, and it's really helpful because I think these black men are showing up really wanting something like this, but it's never seen in it available.

Lorilee Binstock  00:16:56 
Wow. Wow. That's amazing.
Do you
go
after
other organizations or companies to try to promote this?

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:17:06 
Yeah. So I'm I'm hitting the bat everybody. But, yes,
So I work with because the holistic resistance, we do a lot of consulting work with, like, yoga studios, and we work with
just different orgs throughout the last ten years or seven years, almost seniors.
And so I'm constantly
letting them know that I'm available
to
offer this project consulting work. And so the three men three black men project in Los Angeles is the biggest collaboration, I have to date with the ResMA
being one of the, you know, New York Times best selling author of grandmother's hands. And so this is the biggest I would say he's the biggest, like, Allyship
person that's been, like, I wanna back this. I wanna support this. I wanna join. Unless you come in let invite you into our conference. So I would say, yes. That would be
our biggest. I I just talked to a couple of folks that sent me contacts from folks in Denver, actually, that some retired NFL players that wanna talk to me about this project as well. And I'm really excited talking to folks that have been
you know, on this, like, perform at the highest level of athleticism in football. That's, like, the the biggest native of the black brute, you know, narrative to see how they can think about tenderness football is like the opposite of tinnitus. So talking to retired NFL players would be one of my goals. So I I don't think I'll ever join or or collab with NFL because we're kind of the the poor offices of each other. But folks that have kind of retired or or or left that system, I'm really interested in talking to them. So I'm really used to talking about folks that are retired from

Lorilee Binstock  00:18:21 
Yeah.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:18:31 
these high levels of aggression to think about where is the tenderness in their experience and how do they build that up and how does their personas athlete
hurt or hinder
their Tinder photonic experience with the black men.

Lorilee Binstock  00:18:44 
What about colleges?
I feel like our schools
Is that also something that
you're reaching out to?

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:18:54 
Yeah, colleges are huge.
I haven't had a big success in Uniti, but I think this is a matter of time once I get
a good like, contacts into the college that thought they have that that space, like a good sorority or a group, or people that really are thinking about this stuff. But I haven't made
big context for colleges yet, but that would be a great I imagine that'd be a great place to drop into because of the the age bracket that the challenge of the colleges is that the ecosystem is Pacific. You know, they they have a Pacific way to enter those spaces. And so I'm trying to find the
the most freely liberating way to enter to a college. But, yeah, I think colleges are gonna be a great demographic to target here soon.

Lorilee Binstock  00:19:29 
Yeah. I would think so.
And, you know, I wanted to talk about, like,
DI, our diverse
equity inclusion,
And I I know that you kind of you kind of work around that anti racism work. And and going back to schools, you know, actually, my daughter's school. She's in elementary school.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:19:49 
Mhmm.

Lorilee Binstock  00:19:53 
They actually have a DI representative
at their school.
Do you think that that Yeah. I know. It's really cool. It's it's it's she's been there for several years. She's amazing.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:20:00 
Wow.

Lorilee Binstock  00:20:06 
And I know that you kinda talk about some common mistakes that companies make. So I kinda wanna talk a little bit about that, like, common mistakes that companies make with doing DAI and anti racism work.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:20:11 
Yeah.

Lorilee Binstock  00:20:18 
But I also kinda I'm I'm curious to what what you think about hap hap schools doing it as well.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:20:23 
Yeah.
Yeah. I work with a lot of like, I work with Oakland Unified multiple schools in their districts. So I work with
Palm Springs. I work with a lot of schools over the years.
Schools are amazing,
first of all. And
challenging when it comes to the eye space. It's a very evolving
industry in Howard. It's a powerful place that we transform young folks and teachers' environment, and it's also a place where you have specific limitations.
But one of the things I would say when it comes to schools and common mistakes, that schools can make or we should be watching for as parents and as participants, and then also, like, organizations
that are, like, doing DI work where they can oftentimes stumble. I think school specifically
is
DI work
is probably one of the most sacred places to do it if I can even say that out loud because students, minds are being shaped. And so being having a diverse and thoughtful curriculum,
having a classroom that is tracking all the bodies in there and all the people in all identities, and there is is is is a high task coming out of, like, the last twenty years, but it's an important task to have. The thing I think schools make
how those mistake was oftentimes what what frame is a mistake is they're oftentimes reactionary. So they'll oftentimes call in a DI person after
the harm is done, and the oftentimes fight for budget after damage is done. And that's that's kinda common in most industries, but in schools, it feels particularly painful. You could talk about young young
combines oftentimes
and they're young experience. And so it feels really like it's it's always a eighty percent time is reactionary. So there's some kind of way that
a a teacher or a district gets tune some of the mistakes until they get they get invited to a big conversation. They come in with it. Every once in a while, we get some schools that wanna get ahead of it, but generally speaking, it's a reactionary. So I think one of the first things I think is that it has to be
framed more as
a essential part of the whole educational experience, and that's what that has to it has to have damage before I respond.
So that's what comments that I see. The second thing I would say is
they
demand
help us require the people to get trainings. And I think that's important because the teachers already overworked a lot, and it's hard for them to show up to things. But I think there's a way to give
staff options to leave, the AI training means if they don't have the capacity to be there. I see that because when you force your audience to be there, they're just going through the motions. And I rather have five teachers that are hearing, fighting, ready to go than tin there, like, on their laptops trying to figure how to not be in the room.
Because this is life saving work. This is like CPR. If we're gonna do CPR and you're gonna be in your laptop and someone has a specialty in your classroom, you know, like, what happened?
There are students that are that are losing their lives
on multiple levels because they don't have
a full comprehensive support around their identities and their experience and their education experience in a very vulnerable time. And so for me, I feel like the urgency oftentimes is a there's a song I remember seeing as It says there's a fire in the mountain, no one seems to be on the run. That's how I feel oftentimes
that
I smell the smoke. I see the fire, but it was relaxed. Until the fire gets so big. It's so, you know, starts taking lives, and we start getting get get excited by it. So I'm like, I I wanna see us

Lorilee Binstock  00:23:31 
Close.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:23:36 
get prepared before the smoke is in the air. And so that's the thing that I often will will encourage. The last thing I'll say that often's a common mistake, and I I say this often, but people will kinda go past this quickly, and that is speed. I think people underestimate how much time it takes to shift the culture at a school in a classroom.
And oftentimes time also means more money, but I would say that
it's better to do a methodical,
thorough
DI experienced in a weekend to solve thirty years of dysfunction. So I think the realistic of time
makes sense. If anyone wanted to lose, like, fifty pounds in a gym, they don't go to the gym in a week, and they go, hey. I got a, you know, important date next week. If you didn't get me in this gym and workout, lose fifty pounds. And you train them, but, like, get out of here. I'm not a surgeon. This is it takes it takes months, a bunch of years to drop that kind
of improvement on the body or shift in your in your whatever you're doing. And I think DI, all the same category we have energetic a lot to burn off our our our move through our systems, shape us, and we don't have that kind of
investment. There's a there's a it's kind of an unbalance of how much time it takes to really
heal and notice
and then start building comprehensive,
custom healing practice for that school, and that's the disconnect in that region.

Lorilee Binstock  00:24:49 
Absolutely. I think that that
you're you're right. I feel like in in a lot of places,
having
having a DEI
representative
come in would be very much reactionary.
So I do feel fortunate because I I think they they
designated
my daughter's school's d EI rep years ago.
And she's not she's just she's she there she goes into classrooms. There she brings in a topic,

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:25:16 
Wow.

Lorilee Binstock  00:25:21 
and it's and it's amazing.
And so yes. And I think I think I I feel like and I live in a very progressive area. I'm in Washington, DC.
Extremely progressive. And so there's there are a lot of companies that also have DEI

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:25:31 
Okay.

Lorilee Binstock  00:25:36 
reps, and and so I think that's that's

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:25:37 
Mhmm.

Lorilee Binstock  00:25:39 
really, really amazing.
But in in other places of the country, obviously, there there's still some some struggle and some issues and actually really
educating
and talking about this
this topic. Right?

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:25:57 
Mhmm. Mhmm.

Lorilee Binstock  00:25:59 
And and, you know, one of the questions I wanted to ask was what is the shaping force of the black experience in America. And and if we could also throw in, like, LGBTQ
as well if that if if we can.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:26:10 
Mhmm. Yeah.
Yeah.
You know, when I look at the shaping force, that is when one of the things that has kept me up at night. You know, there's a way that
you grow up and you see your parents and your family, and
you just like our eating breakfast going to school, trying to find who runs faster, and and maybe you got a new belt or whatever is hot in your age at that time, and and you don't notice because you're you're eight, you're ten. You don't notice that you're being shaped.
And so when I look at the black experience in America, I I try to say, what is what are the things I see that are shaping all of us towards a certain direction where events

Lorilee Binstock  00:26:37 
Mhmm.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:26:48 
or structural things in place that that are thematically shaping black bodies in America.
And one of the things I was tracking is because I'm forty one. It's been forty one in May. And one thing I track is that I went to school and high school in the nineties. Right? And what I track is there was a space where I remember living

Lorilee Binstock  00:27:05 
Mhmm.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:27:07 
without
handheld tech like cellphones, especially in high school didn't have a cell phone. Right? And so by the time I got into college and started having more tech, and when I saw store shipping forces, not just we got tech.

Lorilee Binstock  00:27:12 
Yeah.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:27:19 
But it's how black bodies show up in tech.
How are we not just in, like, a tech industry with a hold of a conversation, but on all the platforms with a common theme of how American culture wants to extract
the black experience or show the black experience and how does that shake my experience. And one of the things I saw that's still intact
is
one of the biggest shaping forces
of black male bodies in this culture is athleticism.
And sports. And not just, like, oh, yeah. I play sports and high school. I play football too, but really is
is how much America stops thinking about valuing black bodies after their bias are not used for either hypersexual activity or athletic activity. Once we get past that point, we stop thinking with a handful of, like, Obama who surprises, like, oh my goodness. It'd be president. When we saw this, like, immediate flash pushback against that narrative, it was a shift in our culture to see him become president habit for eight years because a whole different narrative of, like,
how we we didn't celebrate the Obama like bodies, the Obama like thinkers as a collective culture.
Obama did surprise and was interested about that as a shooting force.
And black bodies is how
Obama
was the perfect
timing wise, but the perfect
ideal black body for America, and it was almost too much for America in hindsight. At the time, it was like, Greg, we're we're figuring it out. But I look at his skin tone. I look at his mixed heritage. I look at how
how
manageable black he was. Right? I have no beef with Obama about how manageable he was as opposed to if we darken his skin a bit. Right?
By about five stage, how much that would impact
if we added some some some
some some language that wasn't so smooth. He had to get communicator that was that was very skilled. He couldn't he couldn't communicate
at a level of other other presence that struggle with communication.
He would never be president. He had to speak at a certain level. So but the the shaving force is is is when excellence shows up,
it can't be too excellent.
It can't be too aggressive. So and then there the shooting force is really finding that
that that
lack of attention
for the black body
after
they they they can't be distracted from easily. So NFL, UFC, the NBA, still the dominant,
male domination spaces. Now to expand a bit to the LGBTQ and the and the and the black celebrities to be a little bit outside of my lane, my own name, what happens is that it's echo. There's a complete echo when the black brute is to the dominant
most invested in black body in America.
It does start to set a similar path, a parallel path for that same community of algebraic community and transmedia as well, because transmedia is is is targeted by black sismin,
partly because of our our trauma story around being full human beings too. And so there's a piece where black men had been told, I don't know if you've seen the sign that says I am a man. It was a sign, in fact, in nineteen sixty eight.
Trash, nineteen sixties. I'm sure that's the actual date
trash
protests. The black women walking, you could find it's a very popular I am a man. And you might even heard the phrase that was said historically like, hey. Boy. My stuff. Hey. Boy. Boy was used as a way to diminish the black male. It's been so so black men fought really hard to be men. Like, I wanna be a full
man. The same as I wanna be a full human. Right? I wouldn't be a brute I wouldn't be a full human. And then we get to this era now. We're like,

Lorilee Binstock  00:30:41 
Right.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:30:45 
I don't wanna be a male or a female. I wouldn't be non binary. If you're holding that trauma story, you've fought just to be a man,
that generation is really shook. Like, how dare you even how how how do you have the privilege of of
of of of changing that identity? So so I've been working hard in the cut project
to slow down a lot of cis black men around
being allies,
skillful allies,
the civil to the trans community because of how
we are weaponized against each other as a very tender
tender relationship. And so there's a ripple effect that
we're healing from. And I would say we're we're in the beginning stages of
understanding the depth of how the
parallels between being the black brute and not being seen as a complex emotional being intended, all that's not available.
Weaponizes. There's a lot of things, but also can weaponize us against
our trans community
in a very, very dangerous way. And I've seen some major beautiful progress in that, but there's a way that we're still in the early stages of that. And and and that's also a place where I think
we don't discuss enough. And I would say the shaping force,
you know, in the LGBTQ community, is I have found
the ecosystem is getting stronger. Over the last, say, ten years, let's say, stronger. There's there's government progress. There's financial investment, but there's also legislation flashback right now. So I think shipping force right now is political.

Lorilee Binstock  00:32:08 
Yeah.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:32:08 
It is it is it is political and medical in a lot of ways. There's a way that we've made progress and it's been a clap somebody build, and the lines are being drawn right now. So I think it's a political shaping force. And I'm really invested into knowing how we can
see how this kind of political fallout from East Coast to West,
how we see bodies, and how we support TransUnion, and how we support
the queer community
and how we can build allieship because one of the things I constantly see is that we're we're we're we if we aren't careful,
we can be a lot of internal
collapsing of conflict with each other. And so that's why I'm constantly tracking when I was just at a an event where there's an amazing gathering of folks and it was a some cis black man having a hard time with trans black folks, and it's a white controlled space. And they're like, I don't know what to do. We finally got white people here. Now we have this really complicated conflict amongst the black folks. And this is not new, but it's actually a place where we can actually collapse in our progress of the overall progress
because of those kind of intersections appealing that you take place. So saving force is gonna be how we can skillfully
build village around these tender places where we have historical pain that's showing up
but not being identified until someone tracks it well. So trauma tracking the black group narrative and and transphobia and homophobia and finding ways to land together is gonna be a shipping force, and it is a shipping force right now. Our ability to unify at the numbers we want to see legislation, to see the protection, the medical
accessed everybody that is needed. And we have a history of medical
damage to black bodies, and it's a we were living through these right now of medical attacks on trans bodies too and and queer bodies. So it's a it's a dance. So I think those are gonna be big chicken forces for us right now in this era.

Lorilee Binstock  00:33:49 
Wow. Yeah. That's amazing.
You know, a lot of things there that that that really came to mind. And then, you know, I do wanna mention, you know, an authentic insider in June's issue. We had our prosecutor's POV.
Talk
focus on trans in the law, and it's in it's insane how many
anti
trans bills or or

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:34:12 
Yeah.

Lorilee Binstock  00:34:12 
being introduced, nearly five hundred,

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:34:15 
Yeah.

Lorilee Binstock  00:34:16 
and and and that is it's surprising.
And,
you know,
what what would your organization
do or say
about it about what is happening right now?

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:34:25 
Yeah.

Lorilee Binstock  00:34:28 
Especially during Pride Month.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:34:28 
Well, it's interesting.
Yeah. I think one of the things that's important is resources. You know, I find that when I look at
our ability to move on legislation, our ability to
support
at the medical space that comes down to skillful ways to create capital, and organize that capital to
to interrupt it. We live in a capitalist culture. So I realize right now,
there's a
a place where
funding is needed.
I think we have the heart. We have the that we have the the
the direction you need to go, I think it's the fuel and that's the finance. And so for me, one of my biggest goals right now is to raise capital to port orgs that are doing it. So for me, I I think bodies on the ground is important. I think
showing up and and March is important, but without a sustainable
economic structure behind these orgs, we're gonna find ourselves
stumbling in the fourth quarter, and I think we really need to be strong in the fourth quarter. So for me, the biggest thing right now is
is is painful, and this is almost consistent across all the movements.
Is that if you would've saw my email box,
the weeks after George Floyd
was killed publicly,
And any time we have a massive death publicly,
we get flooded with either donations or emails, and almost you can set a clock to a three months after the event.
Its crickets again. And what's important is that has to be we can't feel resistance only when the media gets excited about it.
I get invited to more speaking engagements, some more
workshops
in black history month, the entire of the year.
But last time I checked,
trans folks, queer folks, black folks were impressed twelve months out of the year. And so there's a way that
I wanna make sure that we show up on the times that
our time to show up for always a, you know, pride month or black history month, then And and when things happen in the media, that's important to notice it. But there's a way that the falloff
does a lot like American. It's like a snacking snacking resistance. So I would say the most important thing we can do is not have snacks on our resistance,
but have a
full meal that we're growing from the ground. It takes twelve months to grow, and we cultivate, we water it as consistent.
To me, I find that to be one of the biggest things we can do is not
let media alone be our motivation to show up for folks that are being talking about oppression.
That's one of the the the biggest tricks, I think, that that mainstream culture goes to us is we have so much content coming towards us that we don't understand the methodical work this looks like. It's that same sensation I feel like when I go in as a keynote at elementary school, and the kids are so excited coming in. I b box nice seeing. I tell them some good things.
And I leave. You know what real superstars are? Those teachers that show up every single
day,

Lorilee Binstock  00:37:15 
Mhmm.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:37:15 
Monday through Friday,
those are the ones we should get on our feet for every day, but it's like I see them every day. I think for granted. That's almost under his men's, like, the news comes in like a keynote speaker and goes, hey. How you doing? This thing has happened. Oh my goodness. How bad it is. Watch a couple times. And then we're all and then we all go away. And it but there's no consistency.
Right? So for me, that's it. That's it. I'm on tour right now for seven months because methodical.
This is methodical
movement across the planet.
To make sure that we're not just having flashpoint experiences.
And so for me, I think that's the piece that I would say we're doing holistic resistance. We're we're encouraging folks.
To take off their sprinting shoes, and put on their marathon shoes, drink a lot of water, and get ready for the marathon version of dismantling the system.
That with capital,
is gonna shift everything.

Lorilee Binstock  00:38:04 
Yep. Constant education.
Just constant constant education.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:38:06 
Yeah.

Lorilee Binstock  00:38:08 
Fantastic.
Is there anything
that you would like to share that I haven't touched on?

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:38:15 
I will say
you're talking about everything, but I would say have deep gratitude

Lorilee Binstock  00:38:19 
No good.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:38:20 
around the cup project. And I would say the cup project is we're making a documentary. I kinda referred to earlier, but we're making a documentary. And I just wanna invite folks, like, you know, all the listeners and people in the community that you might know someone that might wanna be in the film or go through the programming document in the process, we're definitely looking for candidates to be in the film of that project, and that feels like an important
way to scale the the unglobable images of
of a comprehensive photonic touch plan for folks to be available. And I would say, we're also building some cut community workshops coming up
next year, we are in the process of a land transfer in Northern California of a hundred eighty nine acres. It's off grid. This is
beautiful,
beautiful landscape of of nature here in North Carolina. You don't get enough to Anderson Valley, but it's this gorgeous
gorgeous
forest, and we wanna build
relationship with
black bodies, people to go majority, to be with the land,
to be building a a a confident touch plan with nature. Because one of the things in touch plan is to be close to nature as well and singing. Now, miss singers for singers, singing for everybody. So singing
connecting in nature next year because it might as well encourage folks that are interested in that to just, like, reach out, let us know what your interest is, and we'll give you more details on that event. But the cut communities are being built here hopefully, all got United States right now. We're starting to West Coast and we have land here, but West Coast cut community workshops and experiences. So I just wanna invite people to think about that with us, and And if you are
unknown that I know DC is a lot of black folks, so unknown
unknown black cuttle party isn't happening for black men, I don't know about, please let's talk about it because I'm getting as huge. And so on the West Coast, I think that we are building that that coalition, but it's still
an un googled state. And
That to me is one of the things I wanna make sure that we're able to make not rare anymore. So I just wanna name that as a a physical to my heart, and so I'm gonna be on your show and pick your path to me.

Lorilee Binstock  00:40:09 
Well, thank you so much. And and can people find information on
on all of the work you're doing
at holisticresistance
dot com.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:40:19 
Yeah. Holizabethses dot com and cut project dot org. Both of those are are places you can find me.

Lorilee Binstock  00:40:19 
Is that right?
Awesome. Yes. I do have holistic,
resistance
dot com scrolling right there, and
where the fortune cookie is. You can actually click on that fortune cookie, and that will go ahead and send you to that website.
But, Aaron, thank you so much for joining me. It's been a pleasure. This is our hundredth episode, so I'm I'm honored for you to be here today. So thank you.

Aaron JohnsonCut project  00:40:47 
Thank you.

Lorilee Binstock  00:40:48 
That was Aaron Johnson creator of the chronically under touched project and cofounder of the holistic resistance and grief to action For more information on Erin, you can click on that scrolling fortune cookie right there on your screen. We will also have it in the show notes. Also, June's issue of Authentic Insider is out. Checkout Authentic Insider at trauma survivor thriver dot com. That's trauma survivor thriver dot com. If you haven't already, please subscribe to my email list to get authentic insider magazine in your inbox monthly.
Well, that wraps up season four of a trauma survivor, Thrivers
podcast, but we'll be back in the fall for September
in September for season five. Please sign up to our email list to get updates and follow me on social media, you can find those links at traumasurvivorthriver.com. I'm Lorilee Binstock. Again, thank you for being a part of the conversation and joining me for the hundredth episode.
Hope to see you in the fall. Take care.