Teresa: Hello, and welcome back to another episode of Discipleship .ca. My name is Teresa, and with me today is...
Steve: Steve.
Teresa: Thanks for joining us as we have another discussion with the hope,
prayer, and goal of encouraging you in your daily walk of faith and journey towards Christlikeness, as we explore Scripture, faith, and the Christian life, as well as talking about what Jesus is teaching us on our journeys of faith.
Today we are talking about, as you're sitting there laughing at me for some reason...
Steve: You are... you are reading the intro with conductor hands. Pointing at me when I have to say my thing, and you're waving into the crowd out here.
Teresa: I do speak with my hands.
Steve: You do.
Teresa: And I emphasize things, but then sometimes I hit the microphone. It makes a loud bang, so I do apologize to you guys.
Steve: Full disclosure there has only been limited editing ever on on the podcast and most of it has been when Teresa has banged the microphone
Teresa: Or said something I shouldn't
Steve: Blown my eardrums out because it's so loud and I'm the one listening through a headset so that I can hear what's going on in the recording
Teresa: Thank you for doing that by the way
Steve: And one time when she was a straight -up heretic
Teresa: Oh! No! I don't think it was a straight -up heretic I was… well, I guess you either are you aren't.
Steve: But I only took out five seconds. 5 seconds and it fixed it.
Teresa: What was it? I forget what we were talking about. I Said something and I was like - I can't say that, you have to take that out. I didn't, it was a half thought in the middle of something.
Steve: In the middle of something that was directly opposed to orthodox faith.
Teresa: Because I couldn't finish my thought and then I was like, you have to take that out because that's going to be really bad.
Steve: So, there you go.
Teresa: Anyways.
Steve: That's how we end up with it.
Teresa: We are all human.
Steve: So when I laugh at Teresa, it stays in there.
Teresa: Yes, anyways.
Steve: Hey, yeah, so we're talking about the beatitudes today.
Teresa: Great.
Steve: And I don't know when you're listening to this, but we are coming towards Easter and just by God's providence, the book that I'm working my way through lines up almost perfectly with Easter. So, I've been just randomly jumping around grabbing the ones that I like, but we're working through the whole book. And now that we're coming down to it as we get closer to Easter, we're going to start moving towards the Easter stories. The Passover stories that are in the Gospels.
So excited about that. But today comes one of my favorite sections. The sermon on the mount, and it's broken down into two sections. So this week we're gonna look at the Beatitudes and about salt and light, and then next week we're going to look at the ‘don't worry’ passages, and those kinds of things.
So it's pretty cool, but reality is if you think about life, here's the thought to frame it up for us. There are three kinds of people in the world. Do you know what kinds of people they are?
Teresa: Three, you said?
Steve: Three.
Teresa: Like, where are we going? You need to give me some kind of context. I did. I'm not reading your notes.
Steve: There's those who make things happen, those who watch things happen, and those who have no idea what just happened.
Teresa: Oh, I see.
Steve: And as we look at the sermon on the Mount, here's Jesus, the one who makes things happen.
Teresa: Yes
Steve: Talking to the disciples who are watching what's going on, and also speaking to the crowd who have no idea what's going on. Like, this dude just feeds us and does miracles.
Teresa: Yeah.
Steve: We're not really sure what's going on here, and what happens in life is, as you can actually look at life, and I know this is kind of a comical way to say it, but you can look at life in in the way of all of those three are around us at all times. And the funny thing is we all kind of have this kind of tick inside of us where we want to live lives that actually matter.
Teresa: Yeah,
Steve: Like we want some kind of thing left behind. Whether that be family legacy, where you've got like lots of people that come after you. Or some kind of maybe financial legacy where you your children's children's children can live on the wealth that you have acquired and amassed, and you're doing that, or you literally built something and you want your name on it.
Teresa: Right
Steve: Or whatever it might be. We have that
Teresa: There's a driving force.
Steve: People will go to crazy extremes in life to acquire meaning to what we're doing, or to acquire love. To either have things that we love, or to be loved by someone. So here Jesus, in the Sermon on the Mount, sits down with a bunch of people and starts to push in on the way that we're supposed to live life.
Teresa: Right
Steve: What is it supposed to look like? And when we find our relationship in
in Jesus, that's when life starts to really actually have meaning. There's an internal nature to it, there is this longevity that we understand the things that we do here in life in Christ's name actually have repercussions into all eternity. And so meaning starts to become something that is really easy to find in life with Christ. And as we learn how to live life with Christ, life just keeps getting better and better and better, right? So we kind of wonder what he has to say.
So we're going to look at Matthew chapter 5:1- .
Teresa: Ohhh, let's go to Matthew. Guys, let's go to Matthew. I was in Mark and I was like, that's interesting. We're talking about demons. That's interesting.
Okay, I'm there. Matthew 5, Sermon On The Mount. So Jesus is saying this to quite a crowd of people.
Steve: He's got a crowd of people. Matthew chapter 5:1-5.
Teresa: Right. “So seeing the crowds He went up to the mountain and when he sat down his disciples came to him. And he opened his mouth and taught them saying, “Blessed are the poor in spirit for theirs is the king kingdom of heaven. Blessed are those who mourn, for they shall be comforted. Blessed are the meek, for they shall inherit the earth."
Just to five, right?
Steve: Just to five.
Teresa: There you go, that's five. It keeps going, I love the beatitudes.
Steve: Yeah, we're going to take them three at a time.
Teresa: Okay, I love that.
Steve: For three pods, because there's a few. So right off the bat, right? You understand that Jesus is starting to say, hey, if you're like this, you are blessed.
Teresa: Yes. Yes.
Steve: So this means you live with God's favor on you. That's the basic way to understand that, but verse 3 starts right off: ‘poor in spirit’. It's that moment when we know that we're nothing without Christ. Then our our hearts become pliable to God, we actually put ourselves in a spot where being poor in spirit is not a bad thing.
Now that kind of means that we are fixated on God. We want what he wants, so our spirit is not the one that is driving the show. We're allowing, in our lives, our submission to God, is driving the way that we live. When our hearts become pliable to God, he changes us and then we're able to actually see and build the kingdom for His glory, right? So that's the poor in spirit. We don't have that proudness. We don't have that. We've become humble. We've become submissive to God. Even though we may not be a submissive personality, we've done that in ourselves.
Teresa: It's an intentional giving up. Right now, I just started a small book by Tim Keller, called, ‘The Freedom of Self -Forgetfulness. I think that's what it's called. Yeah, so our son was reading it, and thought it would be good for me to read. But I wanted to read it.
Steve: I've read that before and Keller's whole premise and that thing is it we find a sweet spot with God when we actually forget who we are,
Teresa: Right, right? right. Because we also think of ourselves more than we need to.
Steve: That's being poor in spirit. We don't feel the need to be the one who's driving the bus, so to speak, or running the show, or however you want to phrase it, right? And we actually take our lives and orientate them towards God for His glory and His kingdom.
Teresa: Right.
Steve: And that's when we're blessed.
Teresa: That's right, that's right.
Steve: The second one, verse four, is when we realize, so verse four…
Teresa: Oh, “blessed are those who mourn for they shall be comforted.” So there's this grieving, mourning.
Steve: When you realize you can't change yourself or others, we actually are called, like that's a mourning that we have. So I'm reframing these a little bit.
Teresa: A little bit.
Steve: Right. Because there's …
Teresa: Which is interesting, yeah.
Steve: People who mourn, and ‘Blessed are the people who mourn’. If you've lost someone and it hurts. You love them that much. But deep that deep thing, like you've got somebody that you think about on a regular basis and care about even though they're gone. Blessed are you because you've got this soft -carrying heart.
Teresa: Right.
Steve: But in our lives, right? When we realize that we can't change others, particularly after reading the poor in spirit, now we're into the blessed are those who mourn. You realize that there are people that won't humble and submit themselves, and you mourn them while you still have the opportunity to talk to them.
Teresa: Yeah
Steve: It's just Jesus who comforts us, God will pour out the blessing, you'll be blessed by God when you mourn and I think it means also for the ones around us. Recently, and I talk about this a bit, I am a chaplain for a local hockey team of young guys that are trying to get to the NCAA in America to play hockey for on scholarships. I had one of them ask me at the last chapel, am I afraid of death?
Teresa: Like, you personally?
Steve: Me personally. Am I afraid to die? No, it's not the end for me right? But I'm terrified of death for people who I don't think know Jesus, because it's the end for them. And that's what has helped me to think of looking at the beatitudes this way, because there's a mourning there. I don't want unbelievers to be confronted with death because of the way they live, because there's already a mourning if you're going to live your life hardened to God. First you're cutting off his blessing, you're not going to walk in it, and that eternity with God is gone from you.
So blessed are those who mourn, who understand there's...
Teresa: And in that, it's only Jesus that can comfort, because there is no comfort outside of him.
Steve: Yeah, yeah, that's right. So verse five.
Teresa: It says “Blessed are the meek, for they shall inherit the earth.” Which is interesting, I think. I don't know what other translations are. Is it always meek? Because in our society, being meek is not something that is a good quality for somebody to have, it's not viewed as a positive thing.
Steve: Yeah oftentimes. No, and I mean meek and mild, right? That's the way they want to, and that doesn't mean doormat, right? But that's the way we've got to use it in language.
Teresa: That’s the way we view it though…
Steve: So this meekness, the inadequacy that we have, that we see when we're meek. We generally shrinking back because we're not overly confident, or we're not overly boisterous. We're resting in ourselves and that drives us back to God, because we're not trusting in ourselves. We're not trusting in the strength of ourselves.
So the word meek, right? Sometimes it's proud, sometimes it's haughty, arrogant, like those kinds of things, that would be the opposite. If you were to pull that back and you think about it, when we step away from that and we have the humility or the meekness that doesn't trust in ourselves, we're being driven back towards God in faith for those of us who understand who Jesus is, right?
And then Jesus says, "We're the ones that are gonna inherit the earth." Well, what are the boisterous, loud, arrogantly proud people of the world doing? They're trying to take the world.
Teresa: Yeah.
Steve: Like they want. They want everything.
Teresa: Yeah, well they want all eyes on them. They want all the glory, they want the attention…
Steve: They want the world.
Teresa: Yeah
Steve: It doesn't matter where you live, if you think about like Hollywood, or if you are in in Asia, you think of the film industries that are centered like in Mumbai or any of the places that have big entertainment centers - well, what are all those people doing? They're flaunting the way that they are taking wealth out of this world.
Teresa: Yeah.
Steve: And here Jesus is saying, “No”. When we pull back and we don't trust in our own abilities, but rather have that meekness, that humility towards God, then we actually are going to inherit the thing that all these other people think they're going to get forever.
Terea: Right.
Steve: We're going to get it, all of it.
Teresa: Yeah. Yeah.
Steve: And that's a fantastic thought.
So then that brings us to Matthew chapter 5: 6 - 8.
Teresa: "Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they shall be satisfied. Blessed are the merciful, for they shall receive mercy. Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God."
I love that one.
Steve: Yeah.
Teresa: I don't know who's pure in heart, but I love that one.
Steve: Yeah, Jesus is pure.
Teresa: Jesus is pure.
Steve: Jesus is, so when when you know verse six says “Blessed are those
Teresa: “who hunger and thirst”
Steve: I should have probably written these down.
Teresa: Which is quite funny to me that you didn't because you’re usually pretty good. I’m kind of enjoying this…
Steve: And then I sat down to record
Teresa: without your bible.
Steve: I don't even have a bible in front of me, I just have a sheet of paper. I'm a disaster.
Teresa: You're just a hot mess today, babe.
Steve: Pretty much.
But when we're humble, right, and we develop a hunger to know who God is, then he promises to actually fill us.
Teresa: I do, I love that.
Steve: I mean, a perfect example of this, is this podcast.
Teresa: Right.
Steve: We're doing this, not because we thought anybody would listen.
Teresa: Actually, it's sometimes surprising that people do.
Steve: Yeah, we sometimes are confused as to why you're all on this journey with us, but you are. So that's okay.
Teresa: And we're thankful.
Steve: And we are thankful for you. And what it is, though, is we wanted to have a reason, on a timeline to dig into things that we've wanted to dig into. And so it was framed around discipleship because there's a lot of things that we can figure out and do. Teresa wanted to work through some book of the Bible in a chronological, page by page kind of deal, so that brings us the Psalms on Tuesdays,
Teresa: Right.
Steve: And I wanted to do a whole bunch of different things, so these gospel scenes, they're not new to me, I've been a pastor for 30 years on and off. They're all things that I've heard before, but we hunger to learn more. We're called to do that, and God promises that He's going to bring us satisfaction when we do that. We will be filled. That hunger will be satisfied in Him.
Teresa: Yeah.
Steve: So it's amazing. Verse seven.
Teresa: "Blessed are the merciful, for they shall receive mercy."
Steve: Yeah. Again, when we show compassion and mercy, it's not because typically in ourselves that we are here.
Yeah, I know. She's looking at my notes. Just relax, I got it. When we show compassion and mercy, it's not because of who we are in our nature. It is not that way, almost no one has that as their standard thing. We're always quite often concerned about ourselves. If you see some sort of situation going on and we don't care
to intervene. If you had compassion and mercy, you would stop at every car accident to make sure everybody's okay.
Teresa: I mean some people do and some people do if they're they're equipped To deal with it.
Steve: Or yeah, if you see somebody distraught, you can't help yourself but get involved. It's not the normal thing for most people.
Teresa: No, it's not.
Steve: But here we are told that if we live that way, if we show compassion, then God pours that out on us.
Teresa: And it might not be that the people around us are merciful to us, but God is saying he will be.
Steve: He will be yeah, and then we get to verse eight.
Teresa: “Blessed are the poor pure in heart for they shall see God.”
Steve: The pure in heart. As you said earlier, who is pure in heart? and there's not many.
Teresa: Yeah, no. It’s not something that is natural to us.
Steve: And you think about it, right? Think about it. Scripture tells us that David is a man after God's own heart. Super problematic.
You know, the adultery, murder, all sorts of things.
Teresa: All of the things, yeah.
Steve: You know, but here God is saying, blessed are those who are pure and heart.
How do we get there? Only through Jesus. It's only when Jesus works the transforming power of what he has done for us on the cross and his death, burial, and resurrection. And the Holy Spirit is working in our heart, we are moved towards purity. And it's only as Jesus gives us His righteousness and takes our iniquity, our sin, the result of sin onto himself, that God looks down and sees, what?
Jesus’ pure life and heart. In replace of us.
Teresa: Imprinted onto us. He doesn't see our wickedness.
Steve: And so that obedience becomes more and more natural to God, because we follow closer and closer to Jesus, and we're more and more in tune to the Holy Spirit and what His work is in our lives.
And so then God's blessing pours out, right? Because there is this faithful obedience. And we can't miss in the midst of all this, this isn't like the dream list. Jesus is literally telling a crowd, “Okay, you want to live with God's favour? Here you go.”
Teresa: Here you go, he lays it right out.
Steve: Lays it out. So Matthew chapter 5:9- 12 .
Teresa: “Blessed are the peacemakers for they shall be called sons of God. Blessed are those who are persecuted for righteousness sake for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Blessed are you when others revile you and persecute you and utter all kinds of evil against you falsely on my account. Rejoice and be glad, for your reward is great in heaven, for so they persecuted the prophets who were before you."
Some hard words there, like some good words though, like to hold fast and stand firm.
Steve: And it helps us to understand what life is going to be like,
right? So the peacemakers, right? And this is, we're not talking about people who join the peace corps, or are peacekeepers in the military. But literally people who choose to try to live their lives at peace.
You don't fight. You're not divisive You're not quarrelsome. You can find these words in other places, where apostles write in their epistles how you should live, when we go back to the ‘one another's’. This is how we're supposed to live with each other. The peacemakers, we carry the name of God into the world and so we should bring peace to others, in between others, because that's exactly what Jesus did.
He came into this world to bring us peace. And that is so that we can live with peace
Teresa: Yeah.
Steve: And so you know, this is one of the hard parts. When you start thinking about people, particularly around churches, it's like, are you combative?
Teresa: Right.
Steve: And if you are, why? Because that’s not the posture that God had. There's got to be this willingness to live at peace with each other.
Teresa: Absolutely.
Steve: Which brings us to verse 10.
Teresa: Yep.
Steve: Which is, “Blessed are the...
Teresa: Yep, blessed are those who are persecuted.
Steve: Persecution. Yeah.
Teresa: For righteousness sake, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Steve: Yeah. How in Jesus annoys Satan.
Teresa: Just put it out there. Just throw it out there.
Steve: That's just how it is. And that means Satan is not happy with, if you follow Jesus, you.
Teresa: Yeah.
Steve: And that means that spiritual warfare follows. Do I think that there is a demon behind every problem that every Christian has? No, sometimes we're just dumb and do stuff on our own. We make mistakes or we make bad choices or whatever it might be.
Do I think that there can be spiritual forces at work in our lives? 100%. And I think we have to remember that. Jesus himself says, "When this happens, it's actually, you're going to be blessed by it. This is a process that we have to walk through and understand how to live out in a way that brings God glory, because this is part of his plan for our sanctification, being turned into Christ, Christlikeness, brought that way.
And the reality is that God is in control. He will deliver us from that. So even when we have those moments where there's spiritual opposition and spiritual forces in our lives working against us, God is going to deliver us through and pour out blessing on us yet again.
Teresa: Yet again.
Steve: Yeah.
Teresa: And then 11 and 12, it does start with a blessing.
Like blessed are you and others revile you and persecute you and utter all kinds of evil against you falsely on my account, and then, rejoice and be glad for your reward is great in heaven, for so they persecuted the prophets who were before you.
Steve: Yeah, if you go look at the prophets, they all get a raw deal a lot of times. And people didn't want to listen to them and they thought they were crazy and weirdos But I do love them. Jesus says we're like them.
Teresa: We're like them, but, great is your reward in heaven. Like, hold on, hold fast, stay focused, eyes on me.
Steve: Before that, when people are insulting you and spreading lies about you and maligning you and persecuting you, you're supposed to have joy. Rejoice.
Teresa: But you're doing the right thing. This is confirmation that you are doing what you're supposed to be doing.
Steve: There you go. See, the beatitudes become this laundry list of, if you can submit yourself to God and live this out, look what happens. By the end, you're inheriting the earth, we're living at peace, we've got all these things going on, blessings of God are poured out, and you're going to have a great reward in eternity.
Teresa: Yes. Yes,
Steve: And then it doesn’t quite end there. So we go to verse 13- 16.
Teresa: Okay.
“You are the salt of the earth, but if the salt has lost its taste how shall its saltiness be restored? It is no longer good for anything except to be thrown out and trampled under people's feet. You are the light of the world, a city set on a hill cannot be hidden nor do people light a lamp and put it under a basket, but on a stand, and it gives its light in all the house. In the same way, let your light shine before others so that they may see your good works and give glory to your Father who is in heaven.
Steve: Right, and I love that. I've preached this a few times and got myself in trouble from the way that I get all excited, because this is where I said that people didn't give,
Teresa: Oh. Oh, for rats. Oh yes, I do remember that.
Steve: We live in a mountainous area, so you see lights all the time. Like, we can look out our windows at night and you see lights across the lake or up the mountain and you have no idea what's below the light. I basically told the church, ‘you don't care about those lights’. That's not the kind of light that Jesus is calling us to be.
Teresa: Right.
Steve: Just like we're not... called to be, you know, there's that old -school Christian book, ‘Out of the Salt Shaker’, not called to be the salt in the container that does nothing. The two examples that are given are salt and light, and the reality is, its proximity to whatever needs to be dealt with, is when those two things become useful.
Salt has to be poured on to meet the salt in the container.
Teresa: No salt, could you lose that saltiness?
Steve: Yeah, you put it in water, you dilute it, evaporate it away.
Teresa: Oh, but then it makes the water very salty.
Steve: Yes, but see, we put a lot of salt into a little bit of water and think that that's how that's going to work. But if you take a little bit of salt, which is salty in itself, and then throw it into a huge pot of soup, you don't taste the salt anymore. You have to put a lot in there. And that, that's the point. You either need a massive amount of it or it has to be very close in proximity.
You have to get it out of the container the salt is in, and put it where it needs to be. So if you're going to cure the meat, the salt comes out and goes on the meat.
Teresa: And a lot of salt.
Steve If you're going to flavor the meal you're going to put the salt out of the container on the meal. If you're going to illuminate something, the light has to be right beside it. They didn't have LED lights. They had candles. So we're talking about a candle. You want to read a book? The candle is right beside the book.
Teresa: Oh, or you have like five? I don't know how they read with just one. I mean, we are used to more lights.
Steve: They read during the day.
Teresa: Yeah, they probably slept when it was dark.
Steve: So the whole idea here is, here are all these Beatitudes. This is how you should live. But then in the world, we don't live like that. We are…
Teresa: Segregated.
Steve: So that we can be separate. But we are to live close… we're to live like that. So that we are in the world and that we're flavoring and preserving and we're illuminating the world with the truth of scripture, right? Truth of who Jesus is.
And both of those things need to be close to whatever it is that they're working on.
And that's the same thing for us as believers. If we're walking out these Beatitudes, living that way, trying our best to bring glory and honor to God with the things that we do, by day by day
Teresa: Yeah.
Steve: We need to be in the community around us so that people can experience that. And that's when things start to change.
Teresa: Yeah.
Steve: So now we're going to jump all the way to the end.
Teresa: I got it Chapter 5:43- 48. “You have heard that it was said you shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy, but I say to you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, so that you may be sons of your father who is in heaven. For he makes the sun rise on the evil and on the good and sends rain on the just and on the unjust. For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have? Do not even the tax collectors do the same? And if you greet only your brothers, what more are you doing than others? Do not even the Gentiles do the same? You therefore must be perfect, as your Heavenly Father is perfect.
Hard words!
Steve: Yeah. So Jesus died for people who hated him.
Teresa: Yes.
Steve: Right to the end of their days.
Teresa: Yep.
Steve: Right? Jesus died for all people. And this is, theologically, you have to decide how the atonement works. And if you don't know what that means, you have to decide how the atonement works.
Teresa: Well, you have to decide where you stand on it. The atonement works whether we understand it clearly or not.
Steve: Whether we understand it, ...
Teresa: Which we don't.
Steve: The basic thought here is, Jesus died and now there's the question of, whose sins does Jesus' blood cover?
Teresa: Oh, I got you. We're not gonna get into this right now.
Steve: Right, we're not gonna get into that. But the reality is, Jesus died, that anybody who receives him as savior would be saved, which means that anybody who could receive him as savior could be saved, right? This is logic. Which means that all those who reject Jesus had an opportunity but rejected him. But Jesus still died for them,
right? But it's just not sufficient for their salvation because they did not accept him.
Teresa: Well, it is sufficient if they were to accept him.
Steve: If they were to accept him. Right, so here we go. There's this hatred in the world that Jesus experienced and he's literally looking at it and saying buckle up like you're going to get the same yeah there are going to be people who are irrationally against us just because we are for Jesus.
Teresa: I like that, irrationally against us.
Steve: Yeah it's just going to be like, “Oh I'm fighting with you because I don't like Jesus. And it's a crazy world, but it does happen.
And the thing is we don't have to like what people do, we don't have to enjoy the way they treat us, but we do have to love them.
Teresa: Yeah yeah.
Steve: So we have to figure out how do we do that? And my basic idea here is, I think we do that by living out the Beatitudes. You know, living those points where you know what? Here is what's going on in your life, this is what the response should be. And if you do that, God will pour out blessing. That's what Jesus calls us to here in these last few verses that we read, is we need to love the people that are around us and that should be the way that we live our lives.
Teresa: Yeah.
Well guys thanks for joining us for our conversation today. If you have enjoyed the podcast, you can always subscribe, leave a like or comment on our social streams or even tell others about us. We appreciate any help in getting connected to people who are interested. As always, you can find us online at discipleship .ca and on facebook and instagram. Have a great day and I hope you can join us next time.
Steve: Until next time.
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