Conversation with Alain Naude – Is there a permanent ego?

Alain Naude was Krishnamurti’s private secretary in the 1960s. He met Krishnamurti in 1963 whilst a music lecturer at Pretoria University and a professional concert pianist. He gave up his teaching and performing in 1964 to work with Krishnamurti. Fluent in several languages, he was very helpful at international gatherings and in attracting younger audiences to Krishnamurti’s talks at a time of cultural change in the West.

This conversation with Krishnamurti was recorded in Malibu, California in 1972 and begins by asking whether there is a permanent ‘me’?

Unless I am free from the vulgar, I will continue representing the whole vulgarity of humanity.

I lead the usual life, along the small river, following that current. I am that current and ‘the me’ is bound to continue in that stream, with millions of others. I am not different from those millions of others.

When you say, ‘My brother is dead,’ and ask whether he is still living, as a separate consciousness, I question whether he was ever separate from the stream.

If there was a permanent self, it would be of this stream. Realising that I am like the rest of the world, that there is no ‘me’ separate, I can incarnate only if I step out of the stream.

Change takes place away from the stream; in the stream there is no change.

What happens if you step out of the stream? The stepping out is the incarnation.

When one steps out of the stream, one has compassion.

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